The New York Herald Newspaper, March 10, 1866, Page 10

10 'y to get those any where abroad, I know we from What we do not etter from the United States, and you ve the advantage of a free market for if the present state of your affairs {, there might be a difficulty a8 altogether exceptional. expect It to be permanent, last, then plainly your manu- » with those of other nations make w might de then Mr. Gart—If its facturers could not ¢ any foreign marke ae Monnitt—We stall have to wait until the position as altered before aday our legislation to @ different siate of ‘airs from the present, Mr. Gaur—If we remove the duties on any articles we now buy from you we cavapen those articles to our own people and increase ther abilty to buy, They would Duy mors. Is it worth while to rum over the list of dutiadle articles now to see if we can deal with any on the principle spoken of? Mr. Moxxitt—I hardly think 0, NAVIGATION OF TH ST LAWRENCE AND LAKR MICHIGAN, Moxmit—In relation to the navigation of Lake igan, in connection with the use of the St, Lawrence and your canals, I don’t know whether you have any late returns. Mr. Gavt—We have roturns to 80th Juno last. —You will uot fail to observe, then, that canals by our vessels is very important u get the same tolls froin us that you do ir own people, and we use them much more largely than you do yourselves, Mr G The Welland canal you do, Mr. Morrit—Not the St, Lawrence canals, because we do pot use the St, Lawrence to Europe, Hardly any veasels go thither, Mr. Garr—You do use them to a considerable extent for vessels goiag down to Montreal, : Mr. Howianp—Aud there is a trade betweon the lakes and Europe. The St, Lawrence route from the lakes to Europe direct is now be ng used to a considerable oxfent. There are two lives now plying regularly. DUTIES LQUIVALENT TO THE INTERNAL REVENUE TAX SHOULD BE RSCIPROCATED, .1—I had hoped you would have been able finite answer tf the proposition of yester- 7—Well, sir, we do, With reference to the the first het we admit that the prigciple is a d we have no objection to have th treated inciple, Indeed we should have preferred » we understand, then, that as far as 1 it would bp satistaetory to m on the footing spoken of ? That there should be a ducy on fish, for example, of half a cent per pound on dried cod, three dollars per barrel on salmon, and 80 ont Mr. Gavr—Well, the idea, as we understand it, is that duties corresponding to your internal taxation should be imposed reciproeaily by either country. . Mr. MoRRiLie-—Just 50, Butit would be very difficult for us to say what the taxes are on particular articies. For instance, take tho fisheries, We do not really tax the fish anything, but we tax the fisherman on his earn- ings, we tax his vessal, we tax at present his salt, we tax the cordage manufactured for his nets, we tax all the iron put into his craft- Mr. W xkY—S0.do we, by an internal revenue tax. —Is it not possible that the revenue commis- r material changes in these par- Moremi—Oh, we contemplate making changes *, and theretore I was about to say that te pre- suspicion of bad faith it would be better to lix at a given rate, ell, then, there is no reason for dealing with each article separaicly. Let an estimate be made of the gencral pressure of your duties, and then class all these articles together as to be imported at such a rate. If you had a specific internal duty on any of them whieh represcuted the whole amount of your taxes, you could ix the rate on that article easily; but, no doubt, in the case of all of them—Jjust as in the ease of the excise on whiskey—there are other burdens. In these that there are burdens on distilleries, brewe- {add to the cost of production, ur stamp duties add a little, Mr. Gar-—We have’some small stamp duties too, Mr Howraxp—We have taxes that in many cases cor- respond with yours. TAXATION 18 WEALTH. Mr. Morunt—In speaking of our texation you must nat We are poor, On the contrary, we were esperous than no Ido vot suppose that the taxation you are bh, dy acces# to the seaboard at os which far more than com And whatever burc cular ariicies pointed out non your than two or earnings of the people. Ty, € cumulative duties on any ted, but tho real pressure three pr from « articles, tuat should be corr on your iabor is what T mention. Therefore 1 believe that adoty of three per cent would represent all the burdens on your industry, if iasy were properly adjusted and equalized, Mr. Mounsi—Perhaps we have @ little inore to bear thou that, Our Siates and cities have debts and expen- attures. Mr. Garr—Well, we have the same local burdens, and probably heavier ones than yours. Our communities cing poorer than yours, the expenses incurred for simi, lar improvements must necessarily We should be very glad to know the intond lo propose, Mr. Moxnitt—We must firstt discuss tha question among ourselves, (The conversation again reverted to the fisheries.) Mr. witL—Our market is so much ter than 1m imstanees you righ moro heavily rates of duty you THE TWO MARKRTS. Mr. Gart—Not exuctly, sir, Our market in Canada is better for you than yours for us, I nxean that we buy more fish from you than you from us. And Canada, be 40 good ax vo remember, lias more than batf the fisheries you have the privilege to use, She bas the Magdalen Islands, where the fisheries are most productive. General GARPIRLD—Does Canade own thew? Mr. Gai t—Yes, and wo have official reports that seven hundred vessels are now bermg fitted out in Gloucester > to our dishing grounds in the spring. r. HowLaNp—The great poiat for us to consider is from our relative geographical position, the in. aintries Fequire that thelr com- n the groaiest free- wae end of the province, and we scarcely ever see their products; we buy the eh we want from you and sena ours somewhere wlse. Mr. Gatt—We both might, by legist: the trate between tbe Uw possess within ourselves y et (rom yuu, while you would have everything you get from us, “Bat the cost of these articles tO our respective peoples would be somewhat increased. The lower provinces take $5,000,000 worth of breadstulfs a year, and almost all from you. We could suppiy them with ull that, So, w pal. We dou't get it from the lower provinces now because We gett cheaper from Pennsyivaua. Mr. HowLanp—Trade in one ar n one direction, or ngs with it trade in other articles, in otter directions. Since we bay our coal from you and send you our bread stots we deal largely with you tu other things too, When tiore is plenty of trade ireighis are reduced and oto transportation besened. If we were to seud b oils direet to the lower provinces, pertiaps they might have to bear the costs of the ret« trip of the vessel or railway car, On this accoant the people there can supply themselves somewhat clcaper in your mar. but the same rem apples io many parts of watry, which now get tuags of many kinds from ond in your owu markets, Mr, Htexmy—We got hail a moellion barrels of fear from the Ucived States in Nova Scotia, And tue Canadians get coal from Peonaylvania Lf flour were forced to come down, coal would no duubi go back. The ouly difference it be that these ariicies might cost beth parties somewhat more than Wf trade were to continue in its ne channel, SOUL INTIMATE THAT THE TRANGT TRADE THROUGH THE oT\TES MAY He STOrERD. Mr Monemti—Perliaps you can also consider the ques. ton of the Uransit of merchandise tirough our respective countries. For we do not know that we may not be com- pelled Co stop the traneporiauion of goods to Canada via Portiand. You import sv many more millions of than you require thot it seems probable some ‘cute Yankoos may be imporiing them into Canada, for the sake of getting ther siwuegled back into the Suites Mr. GALeTlutt is wa eutire misconception, sir, which, I must say, astomishos me greatly, Mr. Moniui—How is it, then, that you consume so eription than you did kets mach more of YORE AGN ir. ALOU are misinformed, er, very much, The consumption of ony Cowntey has nob chonged iu character, fe.toer bave our umports. Ludeed, I may state tint with rogard to whiskey, in which IL snppose most smuggling would be carried On, our production last your was one- Af los than It was the year befor Mr, MonntiI cali your attention to the articles of ea nud sugar. There isa very great differoace im your mports of these now aud formeriy. Mr Gant-There has been a great deal of tea sent into te 1 States from Canada of late, But it nas not Joa of every. de eon smuggled; it was bought im bond in the province, ween (ere was an exceptional tise ia the price of teas i your porte, Bat this tea paid the reguiar datios w your costom houses. Of course, there nivet be some smuggling, perhaps a groat deal, if your duties romain as they aco, but it dues not exist BOW; and to say that your revenuy has saflered « eeriows loss from it is absurd, Mr, Monntut— but largely increased your icles Beyond what you require for » for as tea is concerned, there ‘ity sold to you, but It was through od the batnes was perfectly of tea for 1866 wore 6,333,076 ar ending Jaue, 1866, they were * We cannot reconcile the dour. How & your valuation of importa « att Mr. Moneats—Our ¢ alued in eurreney; our dmpotts in gold. Wour on Wo say avout the timuance of the bondi 1 vere Mr. Gant—We vai lighly the advantage of asing your canals, railways and other means of tronaperiation ‘when ft suits our purpors, and we are ready te extent the mime facilities to you TL think with you that the matter should not coown re to be ‘teeasury order— Mr. Monems—Which ean be stopped any day. Mr. Gatt—It shoul 1 A More eAtisfactory footing, onnidoring the Immense «4juiai couovraed im ik, dareed * * and indirectly. SPTUTS AND bere, Mr. Morntut—Then we should like you to consider the Ae., and to one whether tes cannot be in some siated bY @ mere respecis assimilated. It inay vaniacoons to bouk qountriva to have these duties alike. ors. cnek alike ae to avoid smuggling on either side, “As | -.ppome te not a drug with you, You Would, perhaps, be glad of an opportunity to rat#e your exciee duties somewhat Mr. Gaut—We shall glad to consider it with you Dut would t not be betier that Wo should await in this Cue alee tho coport of whe Kevepue Coumssivucrs, a0 NEW YOR HERALD, SATURDAY, MARCH 10, 1866-SUPPLEMEN? that wo oould have some Idea ns to your daties are | ts that th, °¢ Watcrs might be neutralized with advantage the cones. the fire, provinces, and I will your duty is two dollars per gallon. 1 Agee ea to betb. “8 FREE UST CANNOT BE RNLARGED, Pr ee tt ‘the n, tht Of fishing along fifteen great deal too high for revenue purposes, and I should | Mr. aaa we hw be. post 164 | hundred miles of coast, and tu ° equivalents posted sa not feel justified in recommending to my colleagues or | you, mn, 3 ; i, ( ) ‘122 | certain echedule of duties on “7h, fud other products, to our Parliament any such thing as to merease our duties | As I have already * 88/4, it My ‘ti ‘ 33,7 | and the free admission of burr iistones uuwrought, on whiskey to that amount. T have no hesitation, how- | us to accede to you T proposition to enlarge the free list, 88" 109} cotton and linen rags, fire Y°4, —_grindstones ever, in saying that we have no to adopt what | We shall be compalh ‘4 by oon necessities to seck some re- oA see. 86,655, 638 12.6 | rough or unfinished, gypsum or piaste.” “ground. The may be daverined 4 be the trap Feyenuo standard on | venuecven troma p.{TEof the art cles embraced in the | | statcwent of tea ‘and ex-warehouse | only one of theso five (ree articles we bY aby interest spiriis and tobacco. Reciprocity treaty—tho.%e im which tho trade is largest | from the port of Montreal to tho States during | in is firewood, and that is quite inconsidera"'?. Now, as jal inamount > bare: alone ly suggested Oye eitofen, of | the yeurs undermentionod:— to the article of sb, wo don't mucti eare wast ee oe On eNOS Have you now an internal revenue duty | schedule of the'rates which we shall ask the House. to Futue—. | dau't oe i tose Me Howined ead T have Gnersfore Mr. Gatr—Yes, certainly. er be Mie per is up yee ge = ar ene can $122, come to the conclusion that all matters mui de lott “ Mr. Brooxs—How much do you think your people ip: AF. 5, palpate Ae on oe 117,757 | they will be at the termination of the treaty, to ea could stand as a duty On whiskey? Your opinion might s ty ry 8008 Pentengrt that you wi 84, with by the soveral legislatures of the United States on perhaps guide us as to what we should impose, act upon the wane ie due season, you will allow 30,493 the one hand, and of the British provinces on the other, Mr. GaLr—I should not like to express.a hasty opinion | Some of the regulations respecting the a le and the ————~- 114,696 | as they may please. on that. ‘The point to be considered is at what rate | DAvigation which now exist to remaim im force until you 200,444 THE FISHERIES AGAIN. of duty would illicit distitlation commenee? In both our bes Ly. ted | ir tbe no difficulty about that 618,552 Mr. Huvny—The question of the fisheries is one upon {fous your daties bo that one gallon acid wittiny | Mr: Saren—None at al MNOS | ebson divided ip eptaion, theria, mpon the sage oa tt for tree aitinal potet gn will wurely fold will ver Mr. Hoorer—Suj the 1,086 | now stands under the ue Public opinion 18 not made I think the rate will be found to be between fifty and | Other respects how would you 5}984 | up whether wo are not the losers under the existing con- 4 i—-' ¥ ve sh vr sition, of a lax per gallon bacnraieet eas, the impo- | nis: it will be necessary for acts to pass suspending the 36,495 large bounty givets for the opening of your market for a ioe el dees | Sack ee ek es ne ee a aaa oy gy eg ir. Gaut—, as i ion is cons are interested—viz., . every ove Fcognlzn thet Moray tax spirits as mech as | Parliaments will, however, bo in sossion soon enough to ‘None. — | should not complain much of a duty on dry fish, but we we find desirublo for revenue purposes. I have not had | 970 oat Sige SEAS x do complain of zoap propoged duty on mackerel; and I occasion to ¢xam'ne minutely the point at which frauds | yar ie the only methine eo paris your 34,640 feel that the people of Nova Scotia would not sustain me would commence by ithe. distillation, That, however, is the only one thing we under part of 615,257 —— _ 35,344 | in acrecing to pay any more duty on mackerel than is must necessarily have been looked into by your commis- sioners, and it willbe just as important for us to see their conclusions as for you. The experience of Eng- land is no guide for either of us hi oo 8" Te smuggling from one country into the other there shoul of course, be as n as possible the same excise laws on both sides of the frontier. * * * I do not think the duty much affects the quantity drank, does affect the consumption for mechanical Th EQUIVALENT OF THE RIGHT TO FISH IN INTERNAL WATBRS, Mr. Sarru—ls it worth while to discuss the question of the fisheries now? What interest have you in the con- tinuance of your mght to use our inshore ing grounds? Mr. Mongint—Wo are proposing to allow tho fish you Se pieng ib dhe 0 at a merely nominal rate of uty. ae Surra—TI am speaking of your right or privilege of hing. Mr. Mornit1—We su) that the privilege of open- ing our markets to you would be considered an equiva- lent. We do not consider the right or privilege of lishing iu your waters a very valuable one, Mr. Gait—We suall probably differ in opinion on that qui * * * * * * Of course it * MR. GALT’S, REPLY. Fray; Feb. 2, 1366. Mr. Garr—We have now had an opportunity of reading tho reports both of the Revenuo Commissioners and of Mr. Derby, and we have considered the suggestions mads in those r¢poris with re‘erence to our trade. We ob- serve that Mr, Derby gives the draft of a bill for a new tfeaty, but we hardly think, trom the conversations we have Lad, that you would at this moment be prepared to consider that, We have therefore thought of sub- miiting to you in genoral terms the conclusions to which we have come. We think that the normal siate of intercourse would be to have the inter- change perfectly tree, but the circumstances of the time are exceptional.’ We, therefore, suggest, that all articles in the free list of the Teoteroctiy treaty and | . Such others as nay be agreed upon, should be dealt with on the basis of imposing customs duties as heavy as the int rnal taxes of the United States; that is, if the re- spective countries wish. In regard to the fisheries and the navigation, we think no new arrangements are re- quired, As far as the improvement of the St. Lawrence is concerned, it bas been brought before us, conse- quent upon the proceeding at Toit, and we are“ prepared to euter into engagements on the subject. With pect to the transit trade, we agree with you that it would be desirable that the regulations for pass ‘sing goods under bond should be reduced to the (orm of law, und there seems to be no reason why a uniform system should not bo adopted. We then come to the question of protecting your revenue from smuggling. So far as Canada is concerned we can speak more spect- cally than the represeutatives of the other proviaces, because the question has been considered by our gov- ernment, not by tucira, We bave considered the subject of the assmilation of our duties to yours, on the principat articles of consimption, © With regard to spirits, beer, tobacco, and cognate articles atlected by the exgise duties on them, it would be our desire to unite with you in making the duties such as may be deterinined to be the best revenue standard. We observe that tere is some difference of opin.on as to what this standard is. The commissioners suggest that one dollar currency would be the correct figure, and we have heard the same amount mentioned here, Before we state that our datics should be exactly the same as yours, we should like to know better what yours are to be, We are, however, prepared vo assimilate them. With regard to other articles, too, our government is disposed to make mftcal arrangements on a satistactory footing. Wo shouid wish you to consider the effect of your present law respecting the coasting trade. We are in hopes the day will come when the policy of the United States will ‘not be so restrictive as it is now, Certainly, with regard to the navigation of the internal waters, it Would seein to be advantageous to have the trade free. For at present itis avery great inconvenience to the people on both sides of the live that they cannot make coasting voyag and this is really an unnccessary loss of capital, Is! mention also that we should be prep to assimiiate our patent laws to yours. This subject has attracted a 00d deal of attention op this side, We would make our laws as free as yours are now, ORILCTEONS TO THE CANADIAN FREY PORTS, Mr. Morsitt—Will you aliow me to inquire what the Purpose of your free poris was? Mr, Gaur-~i see that Mr. Derby makes some allusion to that. If we make other ments satisiactorily we should be prepar d to consider that question. The tree ports were estublished before your tariff was a high one, for the purpose of encouraging our mining industry and our fisheries—the former at the Sault; the latter at Gaspe. The war coming on, however, defeated both these objects, and we do not attach so much importance to them now as we formerly did, Mr. Hoorer—I understand that Mr, Derby’s is not an officiat document, but a volunteer thing, made by I don’t know wha: authority. Mr. Gatt—Of course that does not concern us, We byt koow the re, ir. Monniat—I did not suppose the free ports were | of much importance to you. Nor that they had beeu of much injury to os, But they might become depots whence goods might be Ll to ae in an filieit way. Mr. Ho cax—The one at the Sault is liable to abuse, Mr. —! do not think it Mas been prejudicial to | you as yet toany serious extent. Mr. Hegax—The river is very narrow, passable by email row-boate for soveral miles along. Mr, GaLt—I am rathor surprised that, with the facili. ties Which exist, there has not been moro smuggling. Mr. HowLasy—5e am 1, and we know the amount of it for we have a record of all the imports fnio Saute St. Mr. Monnit—This speaks well for the integrity of your people. Mr. HoGax—I found that the gentlemen doing business there were very mueh indisposed to do any trade witir the Amertcan # de that wos not a legitimate one. Mr. Gavt—I aim glad to hear it, Tdid not think they were so particular, Mr. Sura (to Mr, Gatt}h—I don’t exppose you would ob- ject to make the abolition of these free ports a part of te arrangements ¥ Mr. Garr—No, I suppose not, if the other arrange- ments Were satisfactory. THK TRADE OF THE FRER PORTS. Mr. Morni—Can you give us any idea of the trade done at these ports? Mr. Gut—Coriainly, See page 220 of our Trade and Navigation Returns, The total importe at Gaxpe wore only $563,802, and at the Sault $150/740, You will see that the imports at the Sault are of those articles pre- cisely which enter into the consumption of tho people there. There is no indication of its having been made the depot for ittic't trade; stit! Tdo not deny it might be- come Fo, Mr. Hovax—The port supplies the Bruce and other mines—a very inworest.ng part o” your territory. There ism great deal of feolug on our side about ihe cheap. ness of living on yours, and when the country becomes more populous a great many will move over, Mr. ‘onnin:—Vo fee less dilleulty in with the coal and fish interests than a others. tting along many of the GENERAL DIBCUSBION, Mr. Gatr—You seem to want ua to do everyibing for you, but bave not yet done anytuing or offered anyihing of value to us, Mr. swtmm-—About grindstones; you will, I hope, have the partially Wrought grindsiones We export put on your Most reasovalsic list along with rough ones, Mr, Mowatit-~The int nition is to do sy, but not tho finely foisived ones. (To Mr, Galt.) What alterations about the passage Of goods trough countries in bond? ALT—I think the exist ng regulations are sufficient to sutefy both parties; but ey should be defined se- curely by jaw, not be at the option of the Troasury. There is one oth or matter, Under the nt interpre tation of things, American wheat in (anada be- cones foreicn; we submit that this ta an ineouveniont and unnecessary restriction. It simply prevents us (rom manulacturiuy American wheat tato Hour, and sending it forward; Wo imavufweture our owa wheat into four for the Am rean mscket, and consume the flour We make from American wiseat, of ‘onuil—There ie a litle difiealty in identifying American graia a ter Lis importation at arate Mr. Gai —Vi el), 1. does not matter to you about the ori- iu, as lung as you Lave tho sane qoantily passed through that was eat re! Leopte eannyt well defraud your re Vengo so. The worst they could do would be to substi- tute wheat of le bewvor Quauty for poorer wheat im- } ported, Mr, Suirn—In the event of our coming to an artange- ment, fur how & lated peri Mr. Movant 6 Would you make it Jast? For a supa- to the ducati & Mena, expecrmiy Chat part which regm@@ (oe oxpeniiwire on the navigation of the 8) Lawrem Clearly, we should wot desire to commit ourelves 4) an outlay of ten or Ww ive es on mevrance that the trade of niilions—ni Y Way to the seaboard If it proved the West mig’ BInKT Nav Mr, Wesrwon n—w enough for ail ves ATION T) ROROPR, uid you make the canals large stot aa go actos the ocean? foere is hardly any simit to Mr, GALT—No oxagiiy the proposition expre-ed in tant way, Me. Waetwon 01 coorse not. “But T mean, would you make the locks two hundred and Blty feet long? Mr. Gatt—Cortoiniy, that is not muel + isn, how NO Hs to wake ‘em deeper ties the depth of ot have more than water, Tsuppose that, ia 4 to that ques tion, We show bave tarede pe Mee’ ue te. resis of boil parties, You would have to trust for toils ‘Wo thepationage you would receive outside your own ir— We would not botld thease canals for our own trade dione. T think, indea@, ft might well be con: sidered whether It would not salt both parties to put this trade on a better foot'n T am pot authorized to take aay YOyvetivu looking (ula ond, bul my idea the treaty which we cure one Mr. Saitn—You would fii too, ‘The first thing you would find inconvenient wuld pro- bably be the prohibition to pass through the Gut of which would lengthen your voyage a fortnight. | sae Henna would fast tao one fare a ycar of your erman’s pockets, Mr: “Monritt—Have you any idea of the number of American vessels engaged in your inshore fisheries? Mr. Gaut—All the vessels that leave your porte for the Northern fisheries go into our waters, and your own ‘statements will probably show that, But I have pleas- ure in giving you the statement of our officials, which I believe is obtained from actual enumeration, and is therefore reitable. Mr, Morimi—Are the salmon fisheries in your rivers of ng much va'ue now as tormerly? Mr. GaLt—We have protected them of late years, and the uumber of salmon has very much increased. Mr. Swrma—When you considering the duty on timber you should not lose s'ght of the right of floatago down the St. Jom which at present your lumbermen enjoy. Lassume that you desire to have that arrane- ment continued, There is a very considerable quantity of lumber which comes down and is exported free of duty, while our own lumber is taxed a shilling per thousand, Mr. Monrrut—Not now? Mr. Gavr and Mr. Sarn—Cortainly. There {s an ex- port duty in New Brunswick. fuip a 2 rata how do you manage about the proof of origin Mr. Surru—There is no practical difficulty in that. Mr. Monnmt—I hardly think anything need be put in our bill about your right of fishing on our shores, Cus- tom would allow you that. Mr. Gart—Questions relative to the confiscation of vessels engazed in the fishery would arizo. ‘That is, if @ jong vessel should by chance go fishing to your shores —— Mr. Heyry—But these considerations are premature until we see the schedule, The amount of duty you ‘mirht choose to put upon our fish would make all ‘the difference. Unless it was very low we should not be in- clined to do anything more than put fish under the ope- ration of a tariif equal to yours. Mr. Morrint—The question of repealing the bounties on fishing has something to do with this, ‘The bill is al- ready under weigh; but we do not intend to have it passed until we see what we do with you, Mr, Sxura—That does not matter to us; it is simply a question of domestic policy. Mr. Mornur—It make more than a difference ef five per cent. ‘ Mr. Hexey—But with that you will give the fishermen their sait free, which makes It up again, or almost does so. PROPOSITION OF THE DELLGATES—INPORTANT STATISTICAL TAMLES, Mr. Gatr—With reference to the articles you have proposed to take freo, or almost free, from us, Wwe in Ca- nada consume more of what you prodnce than you do of what we produce. The reciprocity would, therefore, be all on one sid». The trado in these articles is, moreover, not one-t-nth of the total trade under the treaty. Unless the other nino-tenths could be dealt with on a somewhat similar footing, Canada would have no interest whatever in maxing the other ments we have spoken of, We bave mada sume calculations as to the effect of your Proposition, and hand them into you. Also other etatements, showing:—The extent of your trade with the principal countries of the world, showing that the trade with British North America ts only second in magnitude to that with Great Britain; the tonnage of your own vessels employed in that trade, showing that it is er than the amount of your ton- nuge employed in the trade than with any other coun- try; the volume of trade with British North America in the articles entered in your first list, compared with the total trade under the treaty, taken from your own re- turns; the volume of your trade with Canada in the game articles; same comparison, taken from our re- turns; the quantity of tea and sugar we have entered for consumption each year since 1859, canis 3 that our consumption. of these arti clea as not materially changed, aa Seemed to thing the other day. ‘The quantity of tea sugar exported from Montreal “in bond,” that is, warehouse,” showing that the annual ‘export of tea to you bas been legitimate, and not illicit. ‘the facts re- specting the fisheries of Amoricans in Canadian waters, and a written memorandum of the propositions this morning submitted. Statement showing tue tude of the trade of the United States with British America and other countries for the year ending June, 1864, from page 320 United States Roport on Trade and Coumerco of the United States—the ree saclay sling Countries. pristo, Imports from. Total. England, Ireland ~~ ar aud Scotland. . $173,551,468 $143,195,714 $216,747,182 Britigh N, Amer- 28,987,147 38,922,015 20,358,150 87,073,034 13,844,756 11,477,627 ou And 67,909,162 57,431,154 en W. Indies burg & Bre- 844391 14'441,617 10,165,414 = $2,558,327 109,712,987 Total.......... $340,292, 139 $329,562,895 $660,855,054 Statement showing the amount of United S.ates ton- nage engaged in the trade with Britis Nort America and other countries during the year ended June, 1564, from pages 325-343, United Staics Report on Trads aud Commerce of the United States:— Owted Saica United Sta es wexcis cleared ibs yet Ts. «41,420,047 (B) ‘261,728 Bridsh Columbia, 85,175 Total. . 169,248 Engiand, and Seotiagd,, $21,073 Spanish W. indies 859,158 New Grawada..., 221,578 British W. Indies 38,573 28,490 Choma. + 26,542 Uther countries... 827,152 Total..........3,000,048 2,006,434 Statement of the trade between British America and the United States in the articies proposed to be with by Mr. Morrill om the footing of the internal re ot the United States, from the United states febles o ¢ and Navigation, year ended Juno 30, 1864:— 17,82 . v7 into ‘he Esporte from Artictes, . & from the the U. t Proviners, Fish of alt kinds. + $1,071,787 Fish gil......+ seeees 74,070 Products of tis. 81,348 Hides, skins, furs, tails Horns ond manures, PFs s Plants, shrubs and trees. . Rice pnd bark. . Gypsum . Other a Just wader the treaty,... 22,695,310 ‘Total under the treaty. . $25,912,661 $19,183,145 citang Seeda,” which Mr, Morrill excludes, ing “Ground Gypsum,” which Mr, Morrill ex juding “Woollen tags." which Mr. Morrill excludes. Statement of the trate between Canada and the United States in the arteles proposed to be dealt with by Mr. Morrill on the footing of the internal revenue dutios o: the United States [From the Canadian retur 1864-5. ; Imports into Exports from Canrda, Cinade, Fish of all kinds, $202,626 $51,805 Fish pile... ccee ee 12,335 pas Products of lel... ec... _ 7,442 Hides, (ars, skins or tails ane dressed 265,075 2,560 108,965, 304,240 250,207 4,524 Total $1,503,446 = “1 140,00 Other ariicies free underihe ” WOME ee eee + 7,909,106 19,923,540 ene — Toinl trade under the treaty $9,131,641 $20,309,170 Statement of the consumption of tea and in Canada for the sh since ge Sass iS thy amount eutered popu. rn oe ost 000 {6 10s, ), 2,783, 100 4,590,000 AMERICAN PARTICIPATION IN CANADIAN FISHERIES. From a special report of W. F. Whitcher, Esq., head of the fisheries branch of the Canadian Crown Lands Department:—The next following those given in the return of June, Mr. s “Essay,” page 7), refer solely to fishing carried on within the disputed sae ew cy ane mamptorily treaty, Americans were admitted. In is of the Gulf of St. Lawrence, United States vessels to the num- ‘ber of about onc thousand four hundred and fifty pursue deep sea Sebing naan & previous But at was for the mackcrel fishery in shore, abont the Islands, Gaspe, Anticosti and the mouth of the St. Lawrence that the concessions made in 1854 wore most desirable, LOWER CANADA, In 1864 there were 232 United States vessels, of an aggregate tonnage of 16,090 tons, manned by 2,673 men, engaged in the inshore fisheries of the Magdalen Islands and gulf and river St, Lawrence. They took $286,930 value of fish, chiefly ‘mackerel, In 1865 there were 387 vessels, of 37,186 tons, and 5,300 men, participating in the same fisheries. The value of their take was $557,230, ‘This value is accownted for by the incrsased demand and high price of fish which ruled throughout 1865, and the practical failure of cod fishing. These facts, while they show a rovival of mari- time industry close, upon the termination of the late reb lion, reflect also on the past returns, avd indicate that the {paucity of fishing vessels resorting to Lower Canadian waters since 1860 is reaily due to the low price of tish and the disturbance of trade, rather than to any seareity or diminution of the supply from which Ameri- can fishermen obtain ‘‘fares.’’ UPPER CANADA, Althongh the terms of the treaty wore not applicable to the fisnenes of Upper Canada, American vessels and fishermen, uniting fishery pursuits with trading, were admitted to the waters and shores of Lakes Ontario, Ere, Huron and Superior, and, as far as can be ascer- tained, their operations have been highly remunerative, Although the herring, pickerel, stargeon, jake salznon and other fisheries are pursued, their chief’ pursmt is in the white fish and salmon tront fishery, From 1852 to 1854 scarcely a sing!c American fishing vessel frequented these lakes. Foreizn fishermen were by law excluded. In 1855 there were but three, American vessels about these grounds, and they bartered goods for fish, but to what extent is not known. In 1856 there were fifteen vessels, most of which carried en fishing, and took away with them $70.213 value of fish. In 1857 there wero thirteen vessels fishing and trading; the value of ‘the fish caught and bougnt by them being $60,000. 1n 1858 there ws eleven vessels, which took $83,142 worth of fish. In there were seventeen, which captured and bought ish to the value of $97,2 In 1860 the fish trade was dull, and only nine vessels entered into it, catching bat $14,000 worth. In 1861 but three American vessels fished, taking not more than $4,000 worth. In 1862 and 1863 there were none regularly onsaged, and four vessels trading bought up (n these two years) about $10,000 worth of fish. In 1864 there were eight vessels in the business, taking $53,000 worth. In 1865 there were twenty-two vessels lishing and trading, and owing to the high price of fish the vatue taken away was $157,504. GENERAL REMARKS, In Lower Canada waters American fishing vessels have been allowed farther access to the inshore fisheries than a literal interpretation of the Reciprocity treaty would entitio them to. Article one restricts them to “sea. fishing’ —that is, the deepsea fishing, and excludes them irom fisheries in rivers and mouths of rivers, Tho river St. Lawrence was held by the old Datch, French and English g ographers, and by the early French ex- jorers, to be contra-distingut shed from the Gulf of St. Lawrence by the bend lands of , Anticosti and St. John. Tho river St. Lawrence there joined the Gulf of St. Lawrence or open sea, Desiring to give a liberal con- struction to the terms of the treaty, the Imperial com- missioner assented to the special detinition of the mouth of the river St, Lawrence as on a line drawn from Point dos Monts to Cape de Chatte, Thas was conceded to American fishermen (under the treaty) the free use of those extensive and valuable cod, mackerel and herring fishing grounds around the island of Anticosti, all along the north coast up the teeming banks situate off the mouth of various rivers discharging into the St. Lawrence between Long Point and Trinity Bay, and thence down tho south conet where the sea and ‘long shore fisheries are peculisrly accesetble and highly productive and whore harbors are frequent and safe and commodious. The in- shore fishings thus opened to United States subjects, in addition to the “ssa fishery" proper of the Gulf, Labra- dor, the Magdalen Islands and Gaspe, exceed a coast line of six hundred miles. Then, as regards the waters of Upper Canada, It could never be pretended that the term “sea fishery” applies to theso inland lakes, Yet Americans have fished and traded all aiong the shores and among the islands of the x lakes, and their par- ticipation in the fishing of Lakes Ontario, Erie, Huron and superior has been restricted only by the laws and regulations to which our fishermen are obliged to conform. Were United States vessels demed entrance to the istand and coast harbors of these lakes, and their tisher- men precluded from landing, no fishery whatever and no trade could be carried on by them in any of the waters of Upper Canada. Practically, Americans have, under the Reciprocity treaty, enjoyed both n Upper and Lower Canada waters a common privilege of fishery which nothing bet the most fair aud liberal policy on the part of Canadians could admit of. Significant fact, not a single Canadian vessel, and not a sob tary Canadian fisherman, have entered American waters to pursue the “reciprocal advantages’ which the second article of the treaty nominally extends to British sub- jects. Induced by the large yield of last season, ‘and high prices, and the prospect of abundance this year, the building of vessels for the sprmg mackerel and herring fishery is just vow very active in different parts of the State of Massachusetts, particularly at Gloucester, where some seven hundred’ voscls are reported as In course of equipment for next seavou’s mackerel fishery. Not allo! these, bat a major.ty, expect to dish in British waters. TMK PELNGATES REJECT THE AMERICAN PROPOSITION AS A wHoun. Teeay, Feb. 6, 1368. ‘The detogates again met the committer. Mr. Gait—We have received irom you the memoran- containing the views of the committee, and I am bound to say that neral tenor produces in us a feel- ing of Uliagpotenment We have, however, to ask you one or two questions, to whht yo! wish us to under. stand by your proposal. Is it proposed that ihe first three parts of it, referring to the navigation, the transit trade and the fix’: ries, should be considered a separate and @stiact, or are they part of oxe combined proposi- tun Y Mr. Monrm!--That, gentlemen, is just as you please, We have mad our ‘propose; of course, we do not ask you to a cept any more of it U yor Ike, Mr. Gant—You will see the bearing of the question; perhape some parts of the proposition may be acceptabie, otlers wot, Mr. Mount —Of course we do not wish to be bound with reference to the language used. + General Ganvrerp—T understand Mr. Galt to ask if the Proposition i intivisible, or whether ove of more parts can be stricken out und che others remain, Mr. Gact—Precis ly, Mr. Moxit—They were not considered as combined Propositions, nor as separate propositions. We wished to 59 through the topics embraced in the Reciprocity treaty, and did so, Mr Gatr-—I th.ok, then, I should understand that the Committers Wish us to treat them as a whole, Mr. Wx -rsortia—that was my viow, General G\kri2L0—I1 the ‘propositions were changed they would not be a statement of the wishes of the com- mittee, Mornita—It would open the whole quesiton again ifoue or other of them were taken out, Mr, Gaut-—And we understand that the schedule of duties n to us for our iufortaation, not as having any relation to the proposition. Is this correct? Mr. Moni.t—That is what we propose to ask of Con gress to do, Mr. Garty—With that under:tanding, wo shall be obliged to express our regret that the proposal, as a whole, js one we cannot Fecommend to our several legislatures——— Mr. Sunm—I do noi yet clearly understand that the metmorandam dors not ¢ t of sevoral propositions Mr, Gavt—Chen T misunderstand Mr. Morrill, Mr. Monniaie—We never had the point raised—you are not bound to take the whole—but we could not say that the same views would be offered if any one, or any two, Of these propositions were separately considered. Mr. Gatt—I bave to remark, then, with reference to the entire proposition, that our tinpression is that the luties suggested are almost prohihitory in every instance, Of course we have ‘ight to dictate In any way what your proceedings shail be, but I thimk I may be permit Ted to state that in our view the seule ig suet as will, in most of the articies, operate as a wtal bar to trade, NO INTERFRREDN BR WITH ViGATION AND THE TRANG:T TRADE, Mr. Gatt—With regard to the three points—the ques : ‘op, tuuelt and Orheries—vwe may speak separately. We do not see that. reat advan! will arise from making the wavigniio eieelton the subject of legisiation. As iar te we in Canada are concerned wo have no disposition to disturb your trade, and we pre- sume you Lave 50 disposition to put barriers in the way lity is, We think, that the same of oura, The facilities continue to be given on both sides which now exit. ‘extworrt—Do you mean the discri ef an,o nd, bat Tosenuly boi will be kept up? Mr. Gait—I propose to reserve to Canada the ete control of that question on the termination of the treaty, pe ngs aye g A eng ed Wwe the same liberty. same we OX) wtale desire 8 not to place st yoar trade, Tt We carriers on both i thom Ny AaKuFURces Of Jems apples ax var (rieudly dispusition pila by the poopie’ of the United States in the shape of internal revenue tax. You have referred to your posi- tion in reference to that taxation. This is, however, rather a question to be settled by yourselves than one to be brought into a treaty between the two countries. Be‘oro the war your taxation was less than that of Nova Scotia; but en tho Reciprocity treaty was made we did not raise that , neither ought it to jbe by you now. In looking over the reports on the fishery been brought to our notice that a ma of the fino mackerel large proportio: taken has been caught within the three mile limits, and to give you the right to fish there is a full equivalent for your viving us the right to enter your markets on equal terms with yourselves, Betore the treaty the duty on mackerel was about $2 barrel. You now that, on condition of our giving up the exclusive right of fishing which we claim, you should tax it $1 50 in gold, or about $2 of your currency, That simply puts the question on about the same footung as it was be‘ore the treaty. Under the treaty a good deal of agri- cultural produce, cheese and butter occasionally went into the markets of the Eastern States, and was admitted duty free. If, now, in addition to levying daty on mackerel and had, Which are the two principal articles which would be affected by the change in the tariff, you tax these agricultural productions also, the people of Nova Scotia would feel that, in acceding to your proposal, they were giving up @ decided advantage without any equivalent whatever, THE DELEGATES CHANGE THAT THE ORJIFCT OF THR UNITED states YS PROTECTION, NOT REVENUE. When we first qitered upon the considoratién of the subject with you @ie proposition we made was of such a nature as to rema@y what the United States considered an inequality in fhe ‘Reciprocity treaty, owing to the pressure of your Internal revenue. We freely assented to a course which) would have placed both countries on a footing of perfeet equality in this respect. We were will- ing to carry out tue principle in all its intecrity. We were further willing—at least Canada, the only province af- fected, was willimg—to avree to such a uniformity in the rates of dutiegas would prevent illicit trade, and thus, by all the legislative power that existed, to protect the revenue of the United States, and establish a reci- procity, not only of trade, but of tariffs, to an extent that would have been decidedly beneficial the States. We were in this instance willing to tribute our mite to the protection of your revenue. We understood, Mr. Chairman, that to collect revenue was your chief object, and that you had this in view in the arrangements you were about to make with us. We thought, there- fore, that we were freely meeting your :deas in dealing with the whole question from a reve- nue point of view. But when, last might, we wore favored with the result of your deliberations, we had but one conclusion open, which was that your report was founded, not on the principle of collecting revenue, but on the pruiciple of protection; and I, for one, felt that I could not take the responsibility of agreeing to a proposition founded solely on that, while at the samo time we were required to open a to the important fish- eng iakareoia of your couatry, without an equivalent, the rich fields whence they colicct so large 2 supply of fish, 1 should have been delighted if we could have come nearer to an agreement on this important subject, I fear that will be impracticable while you continue to abandon altogether the question of revenue. mie UTERIAS MATRASIEA 49st ir. Surru—It appears to mo that these propositions can be practically reduced toa single point for considera- tion. Jassime that as far as the navigation question ‘while you claim to control the navigation of Lake Sienizan, you have not the right to navigate the inter- nal waters of Canada, and you propose to got the right to navigate these in considoration of allow- ing Canadian vessels to navigate Lake Michigan. I set off one side of this proposal agaist tho other. With regard also to the transit trade, I apprehend you are a¢ much interested in its continuance as Canada, These two things I set off one against the other, There remain, then, but two other propositions. You ask for the abolition of the free ports; that is a concession you desire to be made to you, and you propose to have the fisheries opened to you. What do you offer us as an equivalent for this? You will perceive, Mr. Chairman, and so will the rest of the committes, that you do not propose any equivalent at all, You indeed say you will admit tnese dvo articles free: burr stones, rags, firewood, rough grindstones and unground gypsum; but we sell you only a little of these, and if we did you are interested in. procuring for your own country the raw material to manufacture. On referring to your tariff as it was befors, and as you pro- poke to fix it now, we find that you desire to impose upon fish about the same daty as you had before the Re- baa 4 treaty was made, Mr. Moxem:—You labor under a msapprehension, The duty we levied befors the Reciprocity treaty is not that which appears in our present tariff, If you look at the duty that existed before the treaty you will find that it was twenty per cent on all sorts of fish. ‘THE FISH DUTIES CHARGED TO RE THE SAME AS BEFORE, Mr, SsuTH—I think, sir, that these proposed duties, which are specific, are quite equal to 20 per cent. On herrings they aro $1 per barrel; now herrings never sell for $5 per barrel. On shad $2 per barrel, but the ex- treme price of shad is $9 to $10. Mr, Moanina—tHere are the prices as quoted .in the city of New York. Tuo prices of No. 1 mackerel is from $18 to $22; salmon $36; herrings $5 60 to $4. Mr. Haxayv—But we don’t calculate the pressure of the duties ac ord ng to the price of twh in New York. Mr. »Mimt—That price includes a variety of charges — freight, commission and profits of various kinds. Even the thirty cents per ton duty on shipping affects it. When you aaalyze the subject, you will Lud that the pro- posed duty is a creat deal more than twenty por cent on the averace price of these kinds of fish. If this be trae, then, I cannot see—and you will agreo with me—what you ‘are giving us for the right of participation in the lishenes, Yet, 1 think, some arrangements might bo made by you. We take a good deal from you of various articles. Nova feotia and New Brunswick take five or six bundred thousand barrels of flour from you, We have been taking \t free, and our duty, which will come into etlect on the lope'ng of the treaty, is oniy three per cent. Oi course it would affect that trade very much if we were to put a higher duty on your fiéur. And so with other matiers. THR PIGURES ABOUT Pru. Mr. Heyny—I would bring to Mr. Morrill’s attention the fact that the specific duty he recommends operates upou three classes of mackerel, and the $1 50 per barret = No. 3 inackerel, is with ordinary prices equal to about ty per cent, a “4 Ganrirep—Mackerel Nv. 3 is quoted here $14 per re! Mr. Hewny—Your currency is expanded, but your duties are payable in gold. Mr. Surru—So that $1 60 gold is equal to nearly $2 50 Mr. Heyay—The price of Labrador herring in Nova Scotia is $5 per barrei, and $1 per barrel on that is 20 but there was a great deal canght last year, aud vy year at the Magdaien Islands and New- foundiand, that sells for $2 50, sometimes as low as and $1 duty on that poor class is out of propor- together. Mr. Moxnsi—The committee voted on this subject to put a duty, on fish not exceeding ten per cont. if it is more it is a mistake, wun be remedied; but I] think M1 find the duty proposed 4# not more than that, ¢ Mr, Connitne—Mackerel is now selling for a Little over 17 in gold. Mr, Hexnyr—But if you calentate on the price in New York you are dejading yourselves altogether. Mr. Brooxs—Commission, freights, profits, charges, must ail be subtracted from ths gelling price. Mr. Hirey—Could you take as a standard the average price for some seasons before the wart Mr. Mowriti—I don’t tink prices will ever come back to that standard, There is much more gold and other moncy Jn the world now than there used to be. And I don't know whether your fishing grounds hold out as productive as they used to be, Mr, surm——Woutd not the fairest way, then, be to mak» the duty ad valorem? KML —It would be fair fo far as you and the u States are concerned; but {tis the most unfair and deceptive way of levying adaty. 1 repeat—if the propored dutics on shad and herring are above ten per cent we sball be willing to reconsider them. Mr. Hewky—There is another important considerttion. ‘When the Reetprocity treaty was, made, ten or eleven years ago, the mackerel tsbing fleet of Nova Feotia was compatat.vely N, We now a very large flect and the poople tind that trade, “larger portion of superior mackerel are caught within the Ustee mile limit Many of them are constanuy pushing the govern: Inent to recognize the necoxs'ty of protecting the fisling frounds, and this makes it tie more diiouit for me to agree to an arrangement which woold pat them at a Givadvaniage compared with foreign fishermen, Mr. Mowain—We are not aliowed to participate at all in some of your most valuable fisheries, WE \ake no salmon or shea--we only take mackerei—and our people say they ouly care for this Ashery im the late frusty part Of the season, Mr. Gaur--With reference to the fichery question, the rates of duty make po difference to Canada—we buy tish from you, we don't sell to you in any quantity. Tne considerations we reesived in the former troaty for giving You the right of fishing, were the general arrangements of yee Babee Telerenc? to our products, and go re- duction in the rates of duty on tis would aiver the feel of Mr. low! myrelf, ir. Hesny—Troe, There was a feeling with us, and it ett that in that treaty the interests of Nova were away to get @ good bargain for ype eye fer Mogg oe. CNIFED STATAS RATES ARR FOR RETRVOE j rates are fixed solely with @ view to Steiner cue ee: the wheat nin gral’ sad Wo encote. people to grind i, Mr. Hevry—Ten cents a bushel for ents will turn them to England. . The Teland cate go to England now, in part; they go there in future, “As for barley, I expect you will it in the shape of whiskey. (Laughter.) Mr. Gati—I am. afraid, sir, there is such a difference and ours, that to discuss these General Ganrienp—Wi Mr. Garr—The im) these articles as wil where, Woe shall, probably, make such concessions to were other countries as we to make first to you—our best pelghbors, Wi our people that the market oa tte uaa Mr. Clatt—We contend that in the trade betwoen Cana- da and uve United States the proximity of the two coum tries makes it desirable to exchange our rouppolivs pre Seationn, freely. We buy and the article by urns, Mr, Mornua—-We propose to reduce the duty on coal 80 as to not more than cover the internal revenue taxes, Mr. Gavr—Weil, sir, wo don’t supply you with am ounce of coal from Canada, We buy 009 or $700,000 worth from you. And we import mere than we sil te you of every article you treat as free,oron which you put a low seale of duty. * Mr, Morwi.—You have nothing among your produe— tions that we desire; that is the misfortune, Mr, Ganr—Ii that were true, you would not buy frem ‘us so largely as you have done, THE CATTLE PROHIBITION AGAIN, Mr. Heyry—I think I saw al had to pay four conte pepe more for your beef when you stopped buying jt Mr. Waxrworts—Oh, that was my poor cattle bil (Laughter. ) Mr. Gart—I sir, we shall find a very serious falling off in our mutual trade, though of course I hope not. Mr. Heyry—The high of the last few years have diverted our cattle ie somewhat. We eye rd sold to you, But weused to send preserved we England, and, most likely, now that the catule makes @ scarcity there, it will be done again, Canada and the other provinces. Mr, Gaur—I have no doubt we shall Gnd some people who are willing to buy from us, * Mr, Moraini-—t don’t thnk you will find any other people who will givo you thirty-six dollars.a barrel for salmon. Mr. Heyny—Thirty-six dollars! We never got that, Mr, Swita—And our people never got apy such price for sbad as you have mentioned. Mr. Morritt—I repdat, we will reduc? our proposed or to the equivalent of ton per cent, ‘wrri—Even so, that would be far more than an equivalent for your internal taxation. Mr, Moxrut—Your vessels are built without taxation. Ours are taxed on building, on selling them, on —. Mr. Gatt—We hold you will soon be able to ie your people from those taxes, PROSPECTIVE RECIPROCITY. Mr. Mornit1—So do we, but we can’t do it this year. a qo bad ys to see you in, ‘,' pemeonli ©, GALT—We may come An we have derived much satisfaction and pleasure from out in- tercourse, Mr. Henry—Another time, perhaps, the visitors will be ippy to meet you in ouy the visited. We. shall be county. But about the fisheries. _ We learned that you were going to give your fishormen free galt. Mr. Mornitt.—We purpose taking off the bounties, Mr. Hexxy—That will be of no advantage to our fisher- mon. Mr. ban Se gyri it will. . “ Mr. iny—No. Under your system you give $4— ton fora four months voyage. The raokere hen don't get it; it goes to the cod-tishers, Now you are ginesojake nothing from your mackerel Hitiermen, ut, on the contrary; to give them their salt cheaper thas before, That's an additional advantage to them over ours. Mr. Moxnn—Practically, our fishermen will buy theie salt from you. ‘Mr. Huxry—I only wished to explain how taking of the bounty did not affect the subject, ; Mr. Hownaxp—In ‘d tothe mode in whieh you ae to ly the duties on lumber, the dufy must all very heavily on the low grades, With us the of common lumbor is about cight dollars per M—thas te more than an average. From cight dollars it goes up to bs dollars, but you make the duty the same om the whole. Mr. Morriit-—Most that we got from you is of a high clase, We buy up to $69 per Mr. Howtani price includes the cost of trans- portation to your markets. We have pnid $7 50 forthe freight of lumber from Oswego to Albany. That brings up the price very much. ns Mr. Morriti—Mon engaged in the trade here told ua that they preferred specitic to ad valorem dutles—4s saves handling—and say the duty we propose wilt not disturb the trade. Mr. How1ayo (to Mr. Wentworth)—We send a geod deal of lumber to Chicago—used, I suppose, for fending purpuses. Mr. Westworts—And how much do you suppos® we pay at Chicago for it? Mr. How.anp—I suppose about $16 now. Mr. WestworTa—$20. But before.the war we bought it for $8 to $10. Mr, HowLanp—Woll, a auty of $2 50 on that is enar- mous. On the highest grades, 1 spall, itis not excessive. The grades are, however, so well defined by the trade that there could be no dilficulty in establishing a grade- ated scale of duties, even were they to continue specific. Mr. Mornu1—if it could be done withow dilliculty I should have no objection to it. Mr. Gatt—We will give you to-morrow a memorandem embodying our views. But as we do not consider it neces- sary that we should azain meet the committee, I shout take this opportunity, for myself and my colleaguos, of expressing to you and to We other members of the com- mittee our thanks for the courtesy and attention which we have received at your hands, The conference then broke up. Our Terms Kejected by the Delegates, Meworaxpuw.—In reference to the memorandum’ re- ceived from tho Committee of Ways and Means the Pre- vincial delegates regret to be obliged to state that the pre- positton therein contained, in regard to the commorossl relations between the two countries, is notsuch as they can recommend for the adoption of their respective degis- Intures. The imposts which it is proposed to lay upom the productions of the British provinces on their entey into the markets of the United states, are scoh as in thelr opinion will be in some cases probibitory and wit certainly seriously interfere with the pnatea- ral course of trade. Tho imposts are so much beyond what the di conceive to be am equivalent for the internal taxation of the United States that they are reluctantly brought to the conciusion th the committee no longer desire the trade between two countries to be carried on upon‘the pri of . With the concurrence of the British fastipgion they are, Lad therelore, obliged respeostally ealino to cnler the engagemen’s suggested in Unie the upoa Bik orandum, but thay Seu the present views of States may soon wo far modified as to it interchange of the productions of the two @ more iberal basis Wastuncrox, Feb. 6, 1866 ‘ates to the “ of the Canadian Del ritish Ambassador ‘Wash Wasuiwaron, Feb. To His Excetaxncy 8m Frepsnick Bruer, K. 0. ae > te rn bave the honor to inform your Excel 9 renewal ot our negotiations with the United States have coodings, but wo On our arrival », after lency, we addressed ourselves, with y: Be of the Treasury, and we comumnication with the Committee of of the House of ves. After Views with them, aud on ascertaining that extension of the existing treaty would Awerican authorities, bat that whatever be by legislation, we submitied as the we desired arrangemeuts to be made (marked A). In reply we received the memorandu mittee, of which a copy is enclosed (| after discussion that no important modifications views could be obtained, and that we wi consider Choir proposition as a whole, we folt ourselves: under the necessity of dectining it, which the memorandum algo enctosed (C). IC is proper to explain the grounds of our Mnal It will be observed that the most Seer of the expiring treaty relating to the i the produets of the two countries were and that the datios proposed to. be tev prohibitory m their character. The prinei our entering into tations was thereof bie, and we had only to consider whether points were such as to make it desirable for us Into specitic engagementa, These points are three in number. With regard to the firat—the proposed the waters of Lake Michigan and the St. considered that the present arrange te and that the common interests ot beth countries prevent their disturbance. We were not Yield the right of interference in the imposition of upon our canals, We believed, moreover, that privilege allowed the United States of navigating the waters of the St. Lawrence waa very much more than am equivalent for our use of Lake Michigan. Upon the second point, providing for the free transit, of goods under bond between the two countries, we be- lieved that In thie respect, as (mn the former case, the in- terests of both countries would secure the maintenance of exietng regulations. Come this potmt was the demand made for the abolition @ the frow ports extst- ing in Canaila, whieh we wore not disposed to concede, especially in View of the extremely unsatisfactory poal- ton ta which it was proposed to place the trade betweem the two conntries, am ab uot Gahan tdi ints we do ny ro under- should I i q aie gs tid itil z FH a i f i i 4 7 Vi i 3 i il i 3 z i z | § il 4 $i3 i § a ‘On both bee 8 be bes stood na stating: the existing arrangements not be eatended and placed on a more permanent basta, bot only that, taken apart from the more me torests involved, u aid a appear to a6 ab thts time necossary to deal with them excepuonally, “With reference to the rd and last point—the oncor= sion of the fight of fishing in provincial waters—we con- sidered the equivalent proposed for so valuabio @ right to be alterly taadequate. The ofa a unimportant articios free, with she seule of high duties as prog ‘not, in vur opin vice cs we are not wit egotiations, a they may reouned with 8 ty remy We heoe tne bonor to be your Excollency’s most obo dient serventa, A T. GALT, Minister of Canada, $. ‘BOWER ND, Ponmnact't General Canada W. A, HENRY, Attorney © y va Scotia A. J, SMITH, Attorney Geaeral, Now Brops ick