The New York Herald Newspaper, April 6, 1875, Page 6

6 THR GREAT LEGAL CUNUNDRCY, Opening of the Fourteenth Week of the Scandal Suit. BEECHER ON HIS LETTERS. WHAT HE ADMITS SAYING. Negatives with Agony and Emphasis. “WE ALL KISSED EACH OTHER.” Graphic Description of the Scenes and Incidents, BOWEN, BEECHER, TILTON. The Loves and Hates of the Brooklyn Trinity. 18 THERE A PLYMOUTH CLAQUE? | A splendid spring day, the sunlight streaming in through tne tall windows of the court room and uluminating the broad area, where tue crowded multitude sat, Sucn was the scene in the court room yesterday morning when the pro- ceedings were commenced. It seemed to be @ noliday picture rather than @ solemn court as- sembied to try the issue between two men who | are fighting for reputation, as are Theodore Tilton | and Heury Ward Beecher. | A wide margin of both sides of Fulton street in front of the Court was occupied for the greater | part of the day by a respectavly dressed crowd of | idiers, The anxiety to getin to see the perform- auce was excessive. Hundreds remained outside ou the corridors for hours. They were no common folks, bat evidentiy people of good position from @ll parts o( tne country. Mr. Beecher acte his part abont equally as well as on the previous days. He would stil! instst Upon throwing that peculiar tremor into bis voice that the Plymouth pastor can use when anything pathetic bas to be narrated, and yet this method of hig 1s one which excites more of ridicule than Pathos, and it is apity that sucn is tue fact, con- sidering how shorta step it is between the sub- | Mme and the ridiculous, | KEARING UP BRAVELY. Mr. Beecher bore up bravely through his ex- amination during the entire day. He did his best | under the circumstances—ne did nothing ex- traordinary—to meet all the points covered by the letter of contrition or the various interviews with Tilton and Moulton where he is represented, and detectives, that no man | with ordinary sense ever did bejore. THE CONTRITION LETTER. Mr. Evarts ended the reading of the contrition letter, With the words, “Her forgiveness I have, may God put it in the heart of ber nusband to for- give me.” “Was that your dictation?” asked the counsel? “No,’’ was the response, in a faint, sad sone. Then, after @ slight pause, “it’s like the rest, not of my parentage.” The impression was mot so strong as on iormer denials, bat there was @ disposition to applaud. ‘The points advanced by Moulton required more than ordinary tact and ability toanswer. Mr. Beecher met these points with apparent sense and courage, and triumphed. It only remains to be seen if he will meet the crossexamination in the same spirit, and then Beecher will have gained the victory his friends so confidentiy predict. Mr. Beecher was less forciole and impressive than on the previous days, His voice suggests suspicion. People ustening ‘or the frst time to bis somewhat quavering tones will concluge the speaker is a mountebank, and that the peculiar tone of | voice is put op, and that these shakes and quavers in bis voice are assumed, Yet Beecher bas been accustomed to fuse wucn tones and pathetic quavers all his life. Bevag a pecullarly emotional speaker it would be strange 1 he did not insensibiy fail into tne old femiliar habit and method of speech, even thougn De bappeus to be im the witness chair. There “were between twenty and thirty women present in the court room yesterday, Many of the taces were strange aud not by any means inceresting. Tue fact that so many new female faces were present seemed to attract the attention of Judge Neilson, Wasevidentiyin no amiaoie mood. While dis Cussing toe question of applause with the counsel at the close of tne day, the Judge remarked tnat it would be better if ladies not connecied with she Case would reirain from attendiug the trial in future. Hereaiver he would be compelled to re- fuse them agmittance. Among those on the bench were Messrs. Charies 4, Foizer, M. Kessel, D. D. Pield, Jonn EB. Par sons and B. 0. Perrin. THE CLAQUE. Before Mr. Beecher began his testimony Judge Seiison saia:— I wish to say a word to the reporters. In case Of Imterruptions herea‘ter by the audience I wish them to be omitted from your notes. I am ad- monished in that respect in a letter of three pages from a distinguished judge in Toronto, | toink the records would appear much better, and, be therefore, request that any interrup: io! id that wy requests ior order . Rogers, the oficer if be has not polucemen enoug! Dim in keepipg order, be must order more; case of any iuterruption such ar di iat neon when We were remove the persons Who interrupt the Barmuny of ‘he proceevings. This must be dove witrcut Tespect to the person, bo matter who itis. These interruptions are unpleasant to the counsel on botm sides and distract the attention of the jory. Such persons are wanting in respect to the Court; it must cease. Proceed gentiemen. THE EVIDENCE. Mr. Evarts—Recurring to tue scene and date of imierview bad between you and Mr. Moulton St nis Bouse, Inow ask you when Mr. Moulton made the statement, waicn you vave tesiified to, regarding Mr. Tiiton’s iunocence in respect to (ne @atters that had been impuced against his Morality, what effect dia these <tatemenis of Mr. Moulion’s produce on your mina in regard to your leelings and belief om toe sudject’ A. | was taruestiy overgiad, believing it Was $0, aod that ‘Bis sta: ots i Mr. ‘1i/ton’s innocence was au the worse ior velieving guilty, as it mace me iu some jarer of Mr. filton’s Innocence, LETTRR OF CONTRITION NOT HIS. Q@ Is tat paper woicn you sola m your hand tm aby Sense your composition, teat is fandum made by Mr. Mouiton, as Mr. Fulierwn objected to woe wita Question repeated. A. In BO sense is it eomMpvsition o: mine. — 4. Is it @ copy or the product of any dictation of yours? A. in no proper sense of the word ‘‘uicta- ton’ did I dictate it. The witness held the letter of contrition ta his hand, glanced at it a moment and siowly enua- Ctated the words quoted avo “Pid you use the words, ‘| oumble myseit before Theodore Tilton as [ do before my Goat’ “I did not, but I did way’—and bere twe witness gave a rendering of the worda be did use, While bis Voice jost its even tone aud jell almost 10 the iachry move Key touched during the previous day's examination. ® Lask your attention now tothe part of th first cause of that memorandum whica reads thus, “Lask, through yoo, roevdore Tit o's or. veness, ADU 1DOW Humoe miysel oelure Ritu us fa: pe.ore my God.” Did you express tos sen- 1M Ch@se WOrds, OF aM equivuleat 10 tiem, io Moulton a ioas hme? A. Ldio Guts i dia oy, iu View Of the stute@vot made, | jeit (har Wronged Mide-\uet 1 gud Wrouwed With i O18 saath were aoa bad Dumuwe mds eels NEW YORK. HERALD, TUESDAY, APRIL 6, 1875. -QUADRUPLE SHEET. God for It and that | waa willing to bumble myself before Theodore Tilton, Did you use these words or an equivalent to them, “He would bave oeen a better man in my circumstances than 1 have been.” Did you ex- press that clause in tuese Words Or in Words equivaieot in meaning thereto? A, 1 may in some words simi iar t) chat mauy @ tin Q. Ju what respect or ou what tovic, concerning What conversation might you have used words similar? A. From the Jact thai I had sided almost irom the first flush against treodore Tuton and wita Mr, Bowen aud | remembered when | was in @iMeuiries that Mr. Tiiton oad imstapt.y and with Mos! geverous spontaneity leit everything and heiped me and when le was in trouve | sided aguinst bim, Q. Was that your feeling at that time in compar- ing your conduct toward pim’ A. | recollect it very distinctly and shail never forget 1t to the juagment day. Q. Did you express these Words in this clause of vie memorandum, “1 can ask Of him uotuing except that be will remember ali the other hearts that must ache! A, No, sir; Ldid not make any state- Ment tuat I would express by that iormula; t did im that Conversation repel the idea that 1 Was act- dn seifistiy; 4 did call up in various forms and at diferent Umes tn the couversauon, reiterating the relations | sustained to other persons in my household and his bousehoid and iriends in the church who loved me as WU I belonged to their househods. Q. Dia you express in these words or their equivalent this clause of the memorandum, “4 Wil Bow piead tor mayseli; Leven wish | was dead but others wust live aud sader?” A. Oh, toat 18 not my phraseviogy, and itis @ very pale and poor and (veole interpretation of the iutensity with which 1 expressed my sorrow im tue sorrows of other peope. Q. What can you state as having been said by | you carrying out the idea, that it Was not wnat yourself woul. safter, but what others wuuid suffer that gave you concern? Give your conver- Sation On that pdinr. A. 1 was not In a logical mooi, and I did not measure words or jaguion ntences; | Varied tram one mood to another my and OSCILLATED BETWEE! remorse and eXcusatory sentences; there was first That Osclilauok aud Vioration which takes place in a h ghiy excited siate o: mind; lor instance, I Would sometimes express maiguauon, aud & m10- ment alterward I was sorry ior expressing indig- nation that Kuzaveci bad uoge what she did. Q. Did youuse these words, *‘I shail die before any ove but myself seal be :aculpaved,” or words equivaient ? A. No sueu porase as that; I look through Lois memorandum aud ldo pot chink I kee @ plrase Ol miue written On tuat occasion, bat | see the source irom whence they wave been wrung; I do reco:lect expressing myselt very Stroggly; that I'd rather die Loam oring such trouble oF to increase such tioubie; that so lar as 1 myseil sione was concerned I counted lire very smal 1 could make reparation; it Wasa strong expression 0: regret and remorse at tue miscmer which seemed to have been committed by me. fHE POOR CHILD SCENB. Q. 1 ask your attention to the next sentence in the memorandvin— Ali my thouguts are running toward my irieud—touward the poor child lying there and praying with jolded bands,” A. Yes, Q. Did you eXpress what tuere appears? A. Very likely. in substance; only that this is a very pour expression—very meagre. Q. Waat did you say in that connection? A, I dou't know toe ex ression 1 used; 1 kuow 1 jel like @ father standing over te dead body of his chila; 1 Know sue looked like deatn; she bad been uw deur iriend and child (Oo me, aud it seemed to meus if 1 haw destroyea her reason—destroyed ber moral life; sue avpeared to me ty be on the edge vl ilé aud aeath, and | spoke as one Wou.d speak 10 the mtensiiy of my distress. y Ip tims conveisatiog was any suggestion made by Mr. Mouitou im regard vo your seeling sor others, and uot belng exclusively Cuncerned about yourself and your own position? A, Wnen I re- jused to give ‘the retraction be Said ne thought tuat a seliish considera iou; that 1¢ Was mean; ae very likely iM Mis Part Of the conversativn suid something similar (0 thar, bucd can’t recoilect it; very likeiy ne aid. Q Dia jou use these words or their equivalent, as (ney appear in toe wext Ciause of he wemoran~ dum, “she is guiltiess, and 1s sQued against, and bearing tne tran-gressions of another?” A. Very likely; very Ukeiy; bub 1 oad fivea in ths nouse- hoio @ life of intimate Iriendship tor many years, and Ui 1 bad ulieuated her ufections id such a degree and Manner as to have vrougnt discord, and suci distress a8 LO paraiyze her moral sense, Or Tatuer ter reason, aod 1 1 bad been tue veca- gion oi that wiscuiel, and I thougut to myself how could aby man staud— Q You tuvk diame to yourself? A, Yes; I took diame 10 myseli up to the year 1874. Q. 1 will Huw read the succeeding clanse in this | Memoraudun, and usk you you used inese words OF expressio3, where you scated in Stance, “ter jorgiveness | have, aod | bumoiy ay tu Gud (hat be May put it into toe heart of ber nusband to forgive ive algo?” sentence Verity vi bis feelings; Wwe driit of toe interview was such a stacement on my part—a imid loundgi0n, a Kindy iMterierence velween us and ior @ recouciliation, and it was in connection With Ei.zabeth ‘tuton that I said in repeated jorms tbat I seit as is 1 had done her @n incuicaia- Die wroug, out] bad no dvupt atalio! ber for giveness; Dut it was Tilton’s Kindness and recon- culation I very Giuch douoted; our irlead Moui- von was taking with him, and ne was assuriog Me, too, that tue aiMicuty with Tilton Was tnat be hac Oraly fixed im bis mind I was in mortal enmity with bia. Q. now cai! your attention to the phrase in your letter of Juve 3, 1873 (Exhibit 86)—tois purase :--"\(be agreement was made alter my iet- Ver Lo you Was written.” | call jour attention to | that porase aud expression, “tnrougn yoa.’ Were you referring to ‘nls Meworandum on that occasivn, of sowetning )ou had writen? Mr. Be; ojected tu tae question as ieading. Judge Neiison—You can cam ask him what ne Was 1élerring to. air. Eva is—tn that clause who bad you re/er- ence to Wnen yuu spoke o| “my lecter to your’? A. Lnever saw ir until : saw it here; I did not hear o: it us 1 mow recoliect. Q. Did you aiter that time agaimsecit? A. f never saW it till i saw it neve; my urst recollection Of 1. Was Wuen General Iracy, .u Decemver, 1872, aiter ue bad veen catieu on vy ar. Moulton, spoke Olaietter I usd written; aiterward Mr. Clafin asked me about a letter I bac written, ana my brother Edward came (o m= about a ietter—avout @ letter that bad gone aim outot my mind; | had never seen 1, but | sapposeu be bad used the phraseology taat 1 had neard used, DaNTE'S INFERNO. Q@ Lnow call your artention to your interview wito Mr. ttitou on the duin December. Lida you @l Chat loterview use aay expressivg or make Any Feerence Oi any kind On the suvject of Dante's “inierno A. I remember none; I don’t say I Gid not. TILTON DOES NOT ACCUSE HIM OF ADULTERY, Q During tae inierview between Tilton and Jourseif wuen you gave your narrative, did Mr. Tilton in any terms accuse you of the cilme of aguliery witu nis wie? A. iam certain ne dia not. @ Did he by way of accusation or otherwise say to You or intimate to you that bis Wie had ever accused you to vim of aduitery? A. He did mi Q Was tnere at any time during that conversa- Vion raised between you the question whetuer you bad committed aduliery with ois Wife? a. There Was ho such question; no such auusion. no such topic eituer by intimation or by expressed lan- guage in any Mauuver Whatscever. A Siring Of questions to the effect if Tilton, ip bis interview with Beecher, accused bim of having commitied adultery with his wife, met @ clear and determined negative at every turn. Tbe wit- Ness resumed bis normal voice, Hits replies were @ little less prompt, 418 manner less cool and ae. cided than during the otner days. He held his arms folded at one moment and resting on the arms of the chair the next, His bead was well \rown back, his eye clear and steady and his Bair brushed entirely off bis torenead. Q Was there any statement vy him, by verbal or Written accusaviog, or guy UmupUtation against you by bis Wieexcepting the memorandum read here about improper solicitauons? A. Nutuwg but twat, Q Was (here curing that conversation any ref- erence (0, or /ecitai or suggestion Ol, the argu- ment oy which you oad overcome her virtue and TRICMPHED OVER HER CHasTITY? A. NO, sir; one, q Leome bow to the 24 of January; how was it Observed at thatdate’ A. According to the cus- tom vl years past in my congregation and couica my house was open fo receive callers on toat day irom (en (0 seven. @ And how were you personally occayled ana taken up tuat da: nis custom of visiting? A. I cannot reeuil ¢ fic day; Lcun recali tae Custom Of tuose days; | ain usually busy. MF. Beacti—i vdject, as uot acmissivie. BERCHEK'S NEW YEAL'S CALLERS, Q, Accurdiug wo your revoliection 0: that day? A. [have looked at suc memoranaa as 1 found aud accurdiug to my knowledge and veue: I received about 800 caliers that day. Q@ Torougs Wuas nour of ne duy did that oceu- En run? A. Nominaily irom 1 to 7 o'clock, ut really irom avout 1 to 7 o'clock. . Have you any recoliection of any interview With mouilOn on tuat day? A. Oniy tue most shadowy impression—tnat ue ca. Upen meus & Q Butasto any interview or conference with Dimi—what recoliecuon have you on that suoject? A. {bere Was bo conierence—there guuid not lave been auy—there was none. Q Did you go up stale or away from your par- lors with Mr. Moulton tuat day ? A. No, Q Was tuere vu tiwt day aay Conversation be- tweeu you in whic you asked Mr. Mouiwn i ne thougit it would be sae to Mave the sare of Piy- mwutu pews goony A. No, sits uotaing oF the KiOG; J sca be pimoly absurd; that Was the business of cue trusiees, G When Was tie sue for piace? A. uary. _Q It Was to take place the lollowing day? A, that year to take lhe Tuesday alter the lst day o/ Jaa- es. » Dia it take place? A. Yes, sir; 1 presume it did, aie. Q W i iength of preliminary wotice had been given of tne sale? A. Two weeks always 10 Vauce; (Wu Subuuths in auvence; churen Gi Ways Open ‘rum the worning vl (ue au the Bight Whea tie sah takes ind: come iu and elec L0n8 a. , & Was were wuy Gweuesivn between you and | w him ou that day ip regard to any letter that Mr. Tutoa WwW Writing or was to wriie to Mr. Bowen? No, ein; noue, Q. Now, sir, 0 C.e following day was there any meeting between you and Mr. Moultes—the 3x of Junuary or (hereaoouts ? A, Yes, there was, then or tuereabouts; within a few days; 1 think the 3d. Q. Where dit tha. occur? A. In Mouiton’s house, Q We ‘ou there by appotntment or by chance? A. Lean t Say. Q. Aud Where was it held? A. In Mouiton’s chsmoer, Q What was the condition of his health? A. He was to bed, and | think tt was on account of | sickness; tn fact 1 KnOW he was indisposed. Q, He was not too 1! to prevent him from seeing you? A, No, sir, bave never seen Lim in that conaition. Q. While you were there dia Mr. Tilton come in? A. He did. Q. Hac you seen him before that morning? A. TI think not, sir, Q. How did the conversation commence? A. I think “ir, Mouiton began by reierring to the pre- vious talk 1 bad with him; he was repeating it to Mr, Tilton, Q. What had you been saying to Mr. Moulton be- fore Mr. Tilton came in? A. I had been referring to What Mr, Tilton must have suffered; I thought his Seif resiraint was remarkable under the cir- cumstances. q Alter Mr. Tilton arrived how did Moulton continue? A. He toid Mr, Tilton i nad been saying | Very kind toings of nim. 3 | family; that 1 asked his paraoa; I felt I nad been | What aid be do next? A, I turned to Mr. Tilton and told him how | regretted baving veen in apy way subsidiary to toe trouble beiween tim and Mr. Bowen; ! also said that I bad the most profound sorrow jor tae rupture | had made in im tae wrong, and asked his forgiveness for it. EFFECT ON MOULTON. The meeting of Tuton, Moulton and Beecher at Movlton’s house was narrated in cetail, Moulton, who sat offsome distance, kept his ey fixed on the speaker. The bitter, mocking in- credulity of his looks nad soitened down to au ex- | pressiop rather of pitying wonder than of angry scepucism. Q. What toliowed? A, said “Anything In my ower I will doto show my sorrow,” and Mr. joULton said “Lhatis an apology auy gen:ieman should accept.” Q. Did your apology have the desired effect? A. Mr. iiiton appeared to take it ravher reluct- antly, 48 Mr, Moulton said, with marked empnasis, “You ought to accept that apolog;—what do you expecta man todo more?” alter some further tala ur. ‘Tuton did accept tne apology. « How did he accept it? A. Weshook hands, Wuat oceurrea afterward? <A. I think Mr, Tilton withdrew, Q Was any reference made at that conversation to the charges in regard to Mrs, 1iltout A. I do not UNUK $0, Q. Dia you talk about them after Mr. Tilton left? A. ido not remember any such conversation. Q, Do you remember au observation Mr. Moulton made tO Mr. ‘Tilton, such as, “He nas, in my opinion, done everytaing that a man can do with. out Making & puohe statement of Une facts’? A, No, votatug of the kind was said. Q. Was any suggesuon made that a public stacement siouid be made? A. On the contrary, the Waoie drift of toe interview led to the opinion | that the lacts should be concealed. Was there any iuoguage made use of by Mr. | ‘Tiiton such as, “lo speak io & man Who has rained my wile, broken up my house,” &c.? A. Nota word OF it. Q. Did Mr. Moulton make any statement such “Theodore, you musc remember that Mr. Beecher has seat you a letier througn me hum- bling ulmsel! belore you a8 he woud belore nis Goo"? A. No, sir; 00, sir. Q. Did you vurtog that conversation say any- thing as Jolluws:—"ii you Wish that J snould re- ure irom my puipit you Nave ouly to say the word andlwuidoit”? A. The imputation of any such laustaye to me 1s a Wadlesale netuon. Q. Did you stave that the sale of pews should not goon? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember saying, “I have this request to make, thut, snoula you make & pubiic siate. ni“ nt of (nis Lrouvie. )Ou will give me Warning, so | that | may commit suicide and go out ow the wor’! A. No, sir. Q. Was auything said about Mr, Tilton desiring pubdiicity? A. Not at that interview, Q. Did you say anything like the following:— “Furthermore, 1 ask you to do ae tals javor, that waooever else is to be imiormed of tis wiie shail Lot know 1t, a8 she 1s already your enemy and may dbecome mine’? A, No; nothing of the kind was said. A WHOLESALE FICTION. “The imputation o/ that language to me is a wholesale fiction.” The witness was at a loss for @ word to characterize the lalsity of the language | attributed to Lim vy Moulton, He was proveeding to stigmatize 1% more iuily when the counsel called g halt, Further on the language ‘Tilton gave Was quoted to the purpose of making Beecher say his relations with Elizabetn were not — always sexual. “No, sir; UO, sir, Q, this is hor- rivie! Before God, no such words passed between me and any wan living.’ Moulton leaned over to taik wit Morris and Tilton sougbt the ear of Pailerton to impart some eager commanication. Toe magnitude of the wo:k before the witness begins to reveal itself. Evarts wastes no time. His questions have more or jess of pertinency. There 1g no traveling outside the record, but as the defence has evidently entered on tne enterprise of covering the whole feild traversed by the Plaintiff the vastness Of toe task begins to be seen. Q. Did you add ‘I will consider it is am addie | tions: occasion ot gratitude’? A. No, sir. Q. Do you remember saying “She was not to blame, i was entirely at iauli; my sacred oMce put we in& wrong pace; 1 suould nave veen ner guardian uot her wempier”? A, something o1 tae Kiuu Was sa.d, Lut sumply waoen I reierred io ti Wroug ‘nat i Dac duce in gainieg oer affections, as Sturements Baa ied me to veieve | had dune, Q via you ever make any sSiatewent acknowl. edging sexual lotumacy? A. No, sir; ic is odiousiy saise. & Did you éver in conversation with Mr. Tilton express jour regret ior baviug wad sexaal inter. course? A. 1018 intoeraole wimust to pe asked suce & Questiv&, and Lelore Aimighty Gud po such btatemens Was ever made Oy me. Q. Vid you ever make the io.owing statement:— “lneVer sougat ner ior any Vulgar end; my intercourse ud beeo turougn luve and not torough just’ A, No, sir; Rutuing of we kind; Ro such language was ever used. Q. Ua Wuut occasion did you say to Mr. Tilton, “Tell me, belore you go away, can you possiply reiastate Elizavets in your iover” A. | remember LO SUCh language: possibly I may have suid 1 Q vo you remeimoer the language of Mr. fitun, gou acted “Bursiog your face im your nan you feit uke @ mun ‘on the edge of bow say, When you spoke Of your grief ior his troubles with Mr. Bowen, taal your wise bad stirred it all up? A. ldo remember making my regrets for his trouble with Mr. Bowem, out 1 did not say tmat I regarded my wue’s interierence as more miseuiey- ous than mine, . As the morning wore on the wiiness became more buoyaat, infused greater vigor into bis voice and grew almost defiant. Beacn and Fullerton were attentive, the former sittiog back in his chair, ys forefinger curied in a ring around nis chin, bis eye scarce blinking, but fixed immovabiy on the witness. Witness—The conversation turneds on Mr. Mr. Tiiton and tow- ard Mme; buat Was some time belore January 10; 1 think it Was on ur about (hat tune; tue ouly way lean UX (he date is OY my miemoranda of my lectures; Loan Mx the laudmarks of it in that way; 1 have gut tae dates dowa of wuere | lectured, Q. How did Mr. Mouiton iniroauce tus inte View of \opic? A. Mr, Moultuu aud I were taiking as \o how ‘ne Wrong done Mr. Tilton sould be ican’t te how Mr. Mouiton Introduced tho nh \ueir order; 1 can give the ubst@ace 01 the conversation. @ Was tue subject of your previous relation wita Mr. Bowen brougut into tae incerview? A. it Was very thoroughly brought into the inter- vies; lie Wauted me to give bim an account of ail my dilicuities aod relauous with Mr, Bowen; ne Wanted to explore tae ground thorvugiiy, to ascertain exacuy where sr. Bowen stvod and where | stoug; 1 thereiore gave him @ succinct view of What J {aougut ol Mr, Boweu, aud thea I gave im & jew O1 the points of ti that hag $p.un@ Up between Mr. Bo Sei, aad, for (he purpose o. reconculng w ficulties ‘between air. Bowen and or not teel in an endeavor to make him do justice to Mr. Titon. Q Now, at Coat imcerview Was auytbing sail to You avout @ietter Mr. Tuton nad writiea or Wi to write to Mr, Bowen? A. I understood Mr. Tul- ton Was preparing & document or exaibit, Whatever )oU May Cail it, Woich It Was Doped would orig bowen to the discnarge of wis obliga tious to MY. Titun; out no weiter Was ever shown me until 1572; oUt some oj tHe sauject matter con- taiued in tawt document or exuiuit, was talKed of betweou Mr, Buwen, Mr. Tiltoa and Mr. Moal- 100; 1, Was @ #adjeCt discussed Letweea them Taluer (Muu abytuiug addressed to myse, 1 NEVER SAW ANY LETTER of the kind nor any Writtem voci.ment on tnat sab- ject— lat letcer inclu i tne Golden Age ace ticle—untii Marcu, 1872; that lever was part of tue tripurtile agreewen:. * . Beiore tat time that letter you had never seen? A. No, sir; lad never seeu it betore toat ume, y Now, sir, In this Interview was there any Mvmorandum of paper presented to you on tai suyect? A. 1 never saW aby memor.udum; lidwra (oa; % ducawegt of paper Was velug pre pared; 1 may ave Gad imverrog@.ories put (o me in regard tO 1t, Out 1 do Hot reo nlect seeing = Q Waa the paper read im you afiog? A. The paper was never read im my bearing, nor any part off, @itavagh che Couteat® (ua were to 08 ju it Were discussed in my prevence, q Wee anyining said to you oy Mt, Moulton as to Mr. Bowen's mouves or reusous jor making 10 ‘ agaioss youl & 1 a i$ it im that ‘iorm, that there wuytuoe OF that suid; Me, ais steadily | my | Q. Now, sir, during this conversation did you | ton asked me distinotiy whether the stories that Mr. Bowea had told air, Ti ton and whien Tiltom repeated, were ‘in any way true—wherner | was afraid of Bowen on accounto’ tuose stories; | said 4 Lsaid, “iedely him vo his jace veiore the whole worid;” those stories 1 was not alraid of 1 the slizitest degree. Q. Now, «ir, 10 What terms dia Mr. Mouiton ex- press himsell, alter your coaversation Wita tim in regard to Mr. Bowen's conduct toward .ou and toward Mr. Tiltou? A, He spoke in yery strong language 1h condemaation of Mr. Bowen's Gon- duct—he thought tf to be wespicabse, cruel, treach- erous, and Wi every Way nan, Tuose words were not omy spokeu, but they were julminated. Q Did be state bis views of Bowen’s purpose in setting you agaicst Tilton aud Tilton against you? A. Yes, we Were to have torn each otaer up and left the track clear to nim. | | Q Im this interview did yoo give Mr, Moulton | @ full account of your iterview with Mr, Bowen | at Mr. Freeland’s ? A, Idid sir, He was horro: | stricken at the narration I gave him, and he qu tioned me 1 It was possivie, |). You went to Mr, Moulton at that time—at — the conclusion of your published statement at | the church—of the settiement between Mr. Bowen and yoursell? A, Yes, sit; 1 gave him a grapbdic ac- | count o: the settlement arrived at betweea Mr. bowen und mysell, Q. Now, in relerence to tue statement made to you by Mr. Moulton concerning the contents or kepnaned, contents of a letter or document Mr, iiton was preparing ior use with Mr. Bowen, Were there uny particulars or names or | instances charges against you men- tioned? A, 1t do not know that they were mentioned in regard to their being inciuded in that document, but we Were lalking Of the charges | Bowen had made; there was @ general convers rges; his charges we: , DUC they Were hot mei aS to me as they aiterward appeared in the etter. Q. Did Mr. Moulton repeat the charge that you jad confessed aduitery to Bowen? A, He said something of that kind at some interview; I toink I laughed; if 1 confessed adultery to Mr. | Bowen it woul! be impressed on my mind; t said to Lim (hat irom the origin of the dificulty be- tween Mr. Bowen and myself down to 1870, and again to Decemver 26, there bad been several arbi- trauons and Many conventions between us, but that Mr. Bowen bever bad any difficulty with me bot upon business, and that ne never made @ statement to me implicating my moral character. GRITING RID OF BOWEN. As Mr. Beecher declared the only difficulties he had with Bowen were of a business character he struck bis knee with the palm o1 his hand, and looked up cheertully as tuougn he had strangled one monster of suspicion for good and aye, Bowen had nothing of an adulterous Charge to make, and as the public thougat he had and that the deience ‘was airaid of him, the witness was delighted at the chance of rolling him out of the way witha wave of his hand. Mr. Beecher went on to say:—Moulton spoke of the matter und said Mr..Bowen was vound to see justice done tu Mr, Tilton; I said L was giad to see nim trying to yet justice aoue by Moulton, and | that as be Was ap expert in bustuess 1 was giad to see hum carrying ogi Wwe matter. Q. Did Mr. Mouiton say to you that he did not | wisa to carry the claim of Mr. ‘Tilton into Court, as it would rip up your relations with tue jamuly of Mr. Iilton ? A. No, sir. | Q Did Mr. Moulton tel! you that Tilton would ratuer take wnat Bowen owed him thaa rip up your 1@lations With wis family OF anything of that Kiud ? A. No, sit. Q Doyou remember whether during this con- versation any Memorandum Of those polnis was broagnt out? A. Yes, sir; I told Mr, Moulton | had some memorandum Oi the polots that were under discussion betWeea Mr. Bowen aud myself at Freciana’s;aiter tos conversation Mr, Mouiton Wauied them; 1 bunied them up and brougas them to him. | Q, Did you deliver that paper to Mr, Moulton at or about that time? A, Yes; it Was about that ume | that begau to put my documents in his bands, | this included, Q Was that paper in Bowen's handwriting? A. Yes, sir. (Paper produced.) Mr. Evarte said tua original paper was not be- fore them, but there was an agreement between | counsel that a copy instead o/ Tue original should be used. Tne Court—There can be no objection to your using the copy. Mr. Evaris read as follow: eee and pubilsh sermons and lecture-room ‘Second— edition Plymouto Collection and Free- lana’s interest. Third—"xXplanation to church. Fourth—W rite me @ letter, Retract im every quarter what has been said to Mr. Beecher—I took each of those points, and told Mr. Moulton What the subject 01 conversa. | tion Was on eaca one of tuem vetween Mr. Bowen and mysell. Q. Did Mr, Moalton, at this stage of the inter- view, state to you what he proposedtodo?’ A, He spoke witn the utmost confidence of compei- jing Mr. Bowen to disgorge; | understand toat tat was What Was proposed to be done. Q. Do you remewber the expression that Mr, Mouitun used on the subject o: bringing Mr. Bowen to terms? A. there were @ good many of | tuem; I think it was in that interview ne suid ‘hac ne would bring him to bis marrow pones, Bowen is the shuttlecock of the trial. Neituer sige Wants him and neither side has @ word of | | Kindness to waste upon him, GETTING BOWEN TO DO JUSTICE. Mr. Beecner—He spoke at tnis interview of bringing Mr. Bo lato some position, so that Mr. Bowen Of aimsell Would du justice to Mr. Til. | too without tue.e being any recourse to legal proceediugs. Q Dv you recollect anything of this character beimg said by dir. Moaliou to you iu regard to @ jetver to Mr. Bowen that Mr, Pilcon wauted to polish sucs letter, omitting all reterence 1D it to your rela/ions witn bis amily? A. No, sir; there Was no sua letter suuwa (o me, and nO saca dis. cussion couid have taken place, Q Do you rewembd-r him (Moulton) saying he approved of that course? A, | do oot reco.lect it. Q Inthe Same wivoth Of January, at wo saver perivd, Gid you uave an interview Wita Mr. Moul- Ton at Mis house Couceroing aa interview be had bad with Mr. Boweo? A. Yes, tue next Gay aster the interview, wheuever it was. Q How did this imterview come about? A. I think it came about by my own Ww: view gave bim the cocumeuts asked for; 1 don’t rewember that ve sent jor me; it was at ois house, 10 the parlur down stairs; tois was alvo; govt the 13tn of January, Dut. will Bot ve po tive. Q. What did Mr. Moulroa tell you in this inter- view a8 to what passed betweea him aod Mr, Bowen; Where dia he see Mr. Boweu?t A. He Su biM at 118 OWD bouse; he had wlreauy told we tnat Mr. Bowen had oeen invited to cali alew days beore; OO that mignt he toid me be was oly ata iulland jong couversation between tmsell and Mr. Boweu, which conversation be | deserioed minurely and dramaticaily. | Q Did ne siow you vow Mr. Bowen stood? A. Yes, and Gow he jooned aod what he said. ing trough tois matter of f OL (hose ECcasions with r ber the subject coming | up ol your i la regard to the iwjury you | pad done Mr. Tilton? A. In that order of time do | you mean f soon after this conversation between you and Mr. Moulton was there any suggeziion of an | expressioa of eeling on your part of naving takea sides against Mr. Turon with Mr, Bowen? A. ldo | HOt recall amy. @ State the conversation as fully as you can’ A. He ailed to witu a particularity taat I 8 « = Ss & @ rt 2 5 a 2 S S € & © le tement | which he bad made to Bi jowen’s | treatment 5 aud of the iniamy of 18 conduct im _ pro- curing Mr. Tilton to write tue letter of tne 6ta, | ana then take it and back it, aod thea stana right ous from under and go over to my side; he wet into the matter wita rel aud effectually, and then opeued on bowen ment of me in almost without e. different stories had Lad interviews at one time and another with him be bad uever dured to mention one of these stories to my face, but only vevlod imy back, and thar they Lever came up eXcept in the settiement | of some Money difficulty wich bad occurred pe- tween a8; be then told Bowen that the last grand settiement nad taken place between him wou at Mi. Fr.eiand’s house, im the presence of Mr. on, tue = eariy” year is70; tuat tat You nad goue over every cause of olfence that you d against bin, and after every one of them had discussed aud @ settlement amicabiy fected; Mr, Freeiand had come and Ped wito 0: bis prom se Gad goue to Lhe house OF Gou; had vhere, in tne presence of «1s ;eo,ie, Tenearsed tue Fecouciliatioa that Had taken piace cetween him and you, and you Went dowo and shook naags With bia at the foot of the ‘ you could telia man’s irieuds \hat you nad toat which would drive Mr. Beecner out of the town in jorty-elwut hours if You should speak of it; Lout t | had taken te document tu a! hands and oad 8,00k itin bis face, aud taat he bad turned as | and he said, ‘WHAT SHALL I DO 9" I said it is not for me to tell you what you should uo; p at the picture hanging on the wail, “L Pecognize to@t man again,” we portrait was my poriralt by Page, the portrait Waicd was then banging there; then he said Bowen Was ready to do auythiag: then 1 said, “Why did you But get tie mouey out oO; bimr’’ ‘Well,” said he, “the time fas not come jor that yer, bat that what Bowen should a0, and ougut to do, Was to put ‘Tuten back in O18 vld positiva Oa the Independent. “Lt Delug te Ustal hour ior recess, the Coart ad- | Jourged autil two o'clock. Q, When Mr. Moulton said, 10 answer to your in- quiiy, “Why im tue movd be iound Boweu ne aidu’t @Xact the Money Or briag Aim ty (ne pow Of paying uy,” JOU said Mr sOoultod suid, time aun’: Come yet,” did We ‘urtner expu siate or aid you imaersvand woac he meant? No, sir, [ was perplexed by it. q ow, Wheu on his ioterview he said to you that (he proper taing for Bowea to do was to put Tito pack on the Jndependent, wus enything said by MoUiCon a8 tO woetner ‘yutoa cuaid Work on tue VAriotian Onion? &. Not | | at oat snverview, | thiuk art it wae dot far from | | sual and to that thar; kt belonged to the same period State of things; be bever sald exactly that; be Spoke of wha’ a grand ting it woust be filtun and I shouid join ‘orces on tae Brookiyu Union. Q. Wuat vid you reply .o that? A, My rep Was (hif it Was an aosoluce impossiblit ¥; the © cumstances surrounding taat paper aud the ie ings Of the persuns eneage cy admit o) such an Assoetut @ Do you rememoer anyciing of a vistt you made waen Mr, Monlioo Was seriously 1 aod mee'ing Mr. Tilton there and having some passage between yoursli and him? A, Weil, f rememver seversl; It Was not an unirequent thing. Q. Do you remember bing there at toat tinle, when Mr, Moulton was regarded by you a3 dan- gerously tly A. Yes. What time was that? A. I cannot say A. Yes, sir. whether in Janaary or Feoruary, Q. Before he Went south? Q. During nar iliness do you uow remember meeting Mr. Tilton during your visits to Mr, Mouiron’s aonse, Wuen He Was go very sick, and did anything pass becWeen you and bin? A, 1 do notseem co recall anything more than tnat we | met there. BECHER AND TILTON EXCHANGE THE KISS OF PEACE. q. Mr. Tilton has spoxen of it as an occasion on which you kissed him on the forehead; do you re- memoer anything about that? A. On yes, sir; De is RIGHT WITHIN ABOUT FOUR INCRES; he stooped, and I kissed him on the moatn. Laughter.) I came from above wuere I had seen ‘rank M. Moultun.was suffering from rheum- atism on the chest or heart, and 1 w apprehensive that it was one of those attaci in Which he might suddeniy go off and I felt deeo sympathy lor him; when tcame down stairs Mr, ‘iton was in the parior, and | met yim and spoke of bim as a friend to both O1 us, @ Atriend of yours and filton? A, Yes; that ts whatl said of bis critical condition, ana there were some otner words interchanged, I do not know woat, but in the WARMTH OF THAT SYMPATHETIC MOMENT we Kissed each other. Q. Do you remeuber using any such expression as this—“theodore, Frank saved my life and L would willingly give my life to save his??? A, No, sir; 1 don’: remember any precise language like what; Lrecouect saying i would almost give my lle to save lis, Q. Do you recollect uslug any expression of this Kind—"‘Frank is very sick; he 13 at the edge of the grave, and, Mf he sould die, what would be rag oO: your case and mine?” A, I do not re- call 1t, Q. | understood you to say distinctly that the letter o: Mr. fi.ton” to Mr. Bowen Was not shown to you or read to you at an interview at that time? A. It was not. no Q. There was which Mr, Tilion occurrence touk memory, Q. Did any interview occur with Mr. Tilton ana 8 present at which any such eY A, No, sir, Not Within my Mr. Moulrou at tis period during January ta | whole) any relauiou you haa witn that letter or gay counectiiou wich Mr. Tilton had in your aif.irs was the subject of @ conversation with | you’ A. 1 aid nos Kuow that there was a letter Ull the spring of 1872; IL Kaew Lhere were slips in progress and documents jorming which were to bring a settiement with Mr, Bowen, and a siate- ment, but thatt: tovk on the iorm of a letter, or that 1 was aletier that I tad anytning todo with, or that! gnew of its contents, I had no more knowledge 0. i¢, aud had no more to do with it than I nave Witt tuings trausacung in China. BEECHER DID NOT KNOW 2HAT BESSIE TURNER WAS A DANGEROUS PERSON, Q Do you remember wuether ut any of the in- verviews spoken of about the, middie period of January or any time (lereubout, at auy interview bet een Mr. Mouitou and )oursel), taat anytniug Of this Kiud occurred on tie sugject OL Miss Bessie ‘Yaruer, Did Mr. Moaiton tell you that fltoa thought that Bessie furmer Was a dangerous per- S00 (0 be Av0at; Coal she Was Wuat Liltoa termed @ (atiler and tuat sue kuew of ail the facts as be.wWeen Mrs. 11tou and Mr. Beecher? A, No, sir; I give the juil knowledge of Bessie ‘Turner— Mr. Evarts—No, not at this moment; a little farther on? A. No, sir, DOtuuE OL Lhe Bort, Did Mr. Moulton say to you that sue would be vetter out of the Way than sere, and did wo reply, ‘i tuink 80, too”? A. L never said it id i never answered it in any such way. Q Was it represented to you by Mr, Moulton that Mr. Tuten suid, as Mr, iucum told him, chat tae best place iF her was to go out West to school’ A. Nu, Sirs 1 knew Dotning of her gomg ont West Lo scivol. , Aad did he teil you that Mr, Tilton could not fford io pay her expenses, ant did yuu say, “Weil, 1 Wil pay (ie eXpenses or ao anything eise Recessary to keep (nis story dowat’ A, No, Hotiog; there Was LO Consultation with me of avy Kid O¢ description Wid respect to or con- cerning the uispusiuva of Bessie Luraer; the ira: Kuow.edge | ad Of her beiug out West was wWueo I was called upoo \o pay her Mrst instal- meat. MES, MORSE’S LEITER. Q. In the latter pars 01 January of that year an interview bas been spoken Oo! oy both on god filton av wuich @ ietter ol Mrs, Morse was brougut under ccosidecation; do you remember a letter of taat kinu received vy you ana banded by youto Mr, Moulton? A. 1 do. Letter nanded t. witaess—Q. Po you remember thatievcerr A. Yes. % in receiving tuat letter, what did youdo with wf A. Learried it to Mr. Moulton, Q Did you bave & couversgativn with him on the subject of that lever? A. I did. Q Dia ne resa tnat lever iu your presence, oe- fore ay coaversation Was Bad un it? A. ie did. What (ueo Was said about tt; did you as« hun for wny wavice—did he give jouuny? A. 1dia; 1 acked him now tue letter £@4 beter be treaved, Dd be suid tat ib sHoud be treated mildiy und kindy, q Waoat did he say, if anything, abour Mrs. Morse? A. He Said airs. Morse was halt crazy; 4c SHO lMAgiNed 4 “real Many thugs, Bod taal she hated MMeodure; Chat sue Was in b teling sto.ies oF maguifyiag incigeuts so chat tuey dig bot repress: tae truth; waar she Was Wor strulued, eXcept vy Uer love (vr Ler daughter. Q Was auythiuy suid about ber crediouicy or her cuarges iu tue iecter, or Ber velei iu aoy of thea? A, i don’t LuInk there Was tien @ specific Genial, bu. it Was assumed that these were wo ve treated —tuat tue Wuule i-iier was Lo ue treated 4s @0 Quuucln4uon of Mrs. Morse; tae Cuarges Were aeuied, 1M ov iat us they respected Mr. ‘TALON Lurking 4vOUL Bua. Q aif MOULOL $4.4 that (hat Was not trae? A. ‘Yes, sir. Q@ Aod aiterward did you write any answer to that letter: A. i diu, sit. (Lecter nub ieu to witue: Q Was that writ tel io wOUl.ou's presence or suowu to tim? A, I Suspect 1b WAS Written IO Gis presence; it Ws nut my paper. uy q itis your writing? A, Yes sir; I suspect it is sxeico Wuico id.ew Up of the ietter, wach be approved oi; Ltuen took .t hume; 4 never wrie on ruled paper. r Q 1: im pencil? A. Yes, sir, Q At law ioterview Or any other ivterview at Whica (dis ie\ter Was (He Suject of couversation Was Mr. Liltop present? A, He Wasunce; lav not Kuow Whether lb was tue Same interview or a savsequent one. Q@ At tals interview was anything sald about Ohe passage 10 that leer Woicd lmputes to Mr. ‘Tuton tas you PREACHED TO FORTY OF YOUR MISTRESSES ? Was there aoytaiug ia that lester of Mra, Morse charging (bat Wr. Tilton Gua stated (hat? A. Well, MIF, 1s HAL CUarge Wide in that letter? Mr. Evarcs—ti velieve pos, q Was there conve. sation at either of the: intervieWs Oi tie iviu oi sauuary f If Shere wert were these sud) Cis {he matter of conversation— Mrs, Morse @ud Mer levter, 10 Wicd It Was stated by uer tuat Mr. liiton pad told more or less pe: sous (tvelve persuos) os your criminal relations Wits Airs. Tiltour A. No, tuere was notome of a that in the letver anu ooching in the conversavion. | Q Was there auyiniog sad avout your having toid Mr. Tlitum vr «py namoer of persons of your criminal relationship wita Mra, titon? A, Trere Was by sua Couversativa. At any time or ju auy of those conversations, from the be.iuning on to we end o January, 1871, Was apy Meuiiog wade iM your preseace oy Mr, Moultou or Mr. Tiiton thay toere any Criwiuar Tewtion ot ever had been criminal relation be 4 You aud Mrs, Trusont Do, be; no tmplivatl n of that Kiad, Was tue Word “crime” aged in your presence io regard (0 you by elwer hose gentiemea or in the presence 0: any ove 1 A, No, m0. & Did Mr. itlton say to you your criminal Teiations With Mrs, filton nad a tora by him to Mr, Uliver Jobusoa and ower persoms? A. Nota- ing of kind. iuis Was vujected to, Mr. Beach stating that the question Called .or (ne conclusion of the witness Without asking WHat Was suid. Air. LVGri8 Said if Ouly called for @ statement made by Mr. {iitou. Mr. Muuitum Wanted to Know if he bad tod twelve persons toat Mr. Beecber aud Mrs. titou fad had crimioal rel tious, ond the quesvion Was Wuetaer ta tuat con- Versation aiytuing Was said to those persons as tocriminal Felativos bewween Mr, Beecher and Mars. Tutou, Mr. Bowca—That is not the question. Mr. BeeCier—No, sir; tuere was uo sach lmpa- tation. 2u@re vas Deeu so mach discussion that I Go not know ii my iormer auswer fits to tue qaes- en. Mr. Beach—You answered the question before 1 got in my objection, Mr. Beecher Went on to say that it was stated Wha. Tiitvu repeared stories relaunag to im (Mr. | Beecher), but that ue subsequentiy rectified we statem@eut im Quarters Where it Was liaeiy to do be ag y Was onything said at this conversation, or eituer oO: thei, in regard to iniormation given oy Mr. i1iton cuucerning relations vetween you and Thtou—giveu to her mother, Morse; you imorued in either 0; those convers. y ar. Litoa that airs. Tilton vad tuiormed her motfer, Mrs, Morse, of the revations between yOu nd Mra, Luton, A. Lao nut recall it. Q Were toe numes of Olver Johuson or Mra. Bradstaw ased as being the names Of persons to whom (nese tions Were communicaced in tue Conversation at (he ena ui Jumuary? A. 4 toink Dot, sic; it they were l do not remember it; born of thet D@ ves Carve sm later, bat L do Mort recall their Dames av being used in tue conversation of January, Q Ai@itner Of those conversations was aay- thing said advat Mr. liltom paving Said or re- Purted taut you preached to jorty mistresses at your Caurcuf A. No, not ag lave as tne end of Jauuaty. Q Woen did any coaversation occur about that? A. I suouid thiuk in about the first two Weeks of danuary 4 went co Mr, Moultoa With the stacement that Mie, Liiod Bad wade suca & atal ibe Q Was avy ning satu avout ais, Josepo Rich- 1b Would uot | interview at that time at | ADIL Of | aras—Mrs. Tilton’s brother—naving come to Mf, Vilion and asked him wether or not he had Doticet sir, Becenei’s Visilg Lo his House, ar Whether he Was quite sure thes were aitoge.nce of 4 pastoral character, Was there any convers sation of tuat cnuracter? A, Between me and whow? Q. Between you and Mr. Tilton? A, No, sir. | Wes auythiug suid to youby Mr, ‘Tilton of this nuture—that Mrs. Morse W.8 im tne story ib this Way: that she was saying, among ner trends and jaimily that theodore Was makiow such god such Ciurges against ELzadeth, und that nis method Oi making them Wasa Very latal way of propagat ng the charges themselves. Ovjected to. s Mr, Kecener—I dd not remember any such cone versation; it would be ajmost tmposstole ior the statement not to ve remembered 1! made; 1 do not think the substance | gorouy of the question came up in that way; the statements taue by Mrs, Morse as to what sie Dad heard against Mr. TuLon Were various, but tuey Were FUC 1D Buch & Way Chas | Leannotgive them defniteness. | | Q. Whatever may or may uot have been said in regard to the propagacou Of the stories. was it said to you einer by Mouiton or fitop that the story of your crimimal relation with | Mrs. Tiiton was bemg circulated by Mrs. Morse? | A. Mr. Tilton or Mr, Mouiton never told me that the story that 1 had criminai mtercourse with nel daaguter, was veimg circulated by Mrs, Morse; they never told me anytiuing of the Kings reco lect three letters of the date of February rie e] | remember an interview before that date which * | had with Mr, Moulton at lis house. Q. Was the subject whetuer Mr. Bowen would restore Mr. ‘Iiltou to his position on the Jndepende ent brought up in that interview? Objected Lo. Judge Netlson—I would ask whether anything was said upon that subject, and, 1180, wnat, It id rather leading, I think, By Mr. Evarts—Was there anything said, Mr. Beecher, at this conversation, as to whetner or not mr. Bowen would restore Mr. Tilton to the | Independent? A. 1 don’t recall it in connection with that interview, Q. What was the commencement of that inter: view as you do reccollecc? A. I don’t know, sir; Idon’t remember what the commeacement was, LTrememoer the substance of it, Q. Well, were Mr. Liicoa’s relations or expecta, tions in regard to the Independent made a subject of conversation? Mr, Beach—At that interview? Mr, Kvarts—At that interview. ‘fne Witness—At that interview my own imprep sion 1s that they were not. Q Well, was auything said aboat any othes papers? A. Ye: | Q What was thaz? A, Well; the Golden age was then uncer discussion; that Tilton was going wa have @ paper jor bimsell was the Keynote, and i Was desirable—snail J go on. Q. Yes, goon? A, don’t pretend to give tl order Oi thougat nor language, but the body of the interview of the discussi0u Was toat Mr. Tiltoa must have an organ for himseif; ne saan’t o@ Volceless nor pu out, and with my infuence and that of my iriends and of ni; triénds a journal could ve established; and if we were to stan¢ together aniiealy, aud Wf 1 Would aiacerely gn¢ coidialiy aid, everyting mignt be accomousbea that Was desiraol t caatinterview ue expressed more jully Woat be had imtimated at several; th ONE GREAT HINDRANCE TO TILTON’S HAPPINES: and ease O1 Working Was, that Ehzaceta didn’t da her part at home, and that she was discontented and sullen, aua that 1 Was impossivle 10 expect man ol genius—and Mr. Moulton spose ot wr. TI ton a8 & man of genius—to wore ull day, tor he said, ‘is it not grand, tuat he has just gone over there and teken off mis cout and begun to wore Tigut at the bottom agin, as il he bad never nad position, and 1s trying to eara wis oread;” he spoke Of 1t a8 ImMpossivle lor & Lan OF genius 10 return home at wiht, amd flud wis wi crying, oF sitting at the head of the suuen'’ and unconyersable, and that irritated = him.” He said, =“ neodore the easiest Man to be Jed by nis affections that ever lived; ilzabeth can do anything wita him, and she wust do ver part, and you must help to make her; that was the geueral jorm of tne conde sel, and then he Suggested that to unity ourselves, cllon, and ty give LO Uns enterprise tue advantage Of periect duty Oo i ing ad counsel, it wou'd be a goud thing. should write a etter to bin (Moulton) jor aun to show to Mr. Tlitoo, ex ressive—— committing myseif on paper to the expreszion o1 my curdiulis) toward him, and also @ letier (o Mrs, Titon, Wi wnom I bad more intiuence, he said, than any iiving veing, in order to brim her under Mr. Moultoa’s counsel, whic! would be concurrent with my counsel and juag- ments and so the «amily Would be Drouzht in and Mrs. Tilton would wake & bappy tome fur him; ) would help him, Frank woud help and irieads would help Bim, and with ols power and expert ence and skill ug Would bave @ journal tuat woud | be heard of ail throago the lang; I thougat it wasn’, au unwise plac; I wrote the Jeters to nig and co her, and pot them in Mr, Moulton’s haods, Now you neve spoken heretolore, Mr. Beecher, . Moulton’s sayibg that tne prvper thing tu be done, to be aimed was that Mr. Bowen should put Mr, Tilton K on the Jndependent, Previous to this conversation which you now Speak of, bad you heard in any way irom Mi | Moulton whetner that expectatiun or pla had or had not been abandoned? A, He told me in the interview jolloWin< his interview With Mr, Bowea that had made that suggescion to Mr, Bowen, and that Mr. Bowen bad not rejected t but Said he dida’t see how now it could be—a0" | he could put him back. Q Yes, and this had preceded your conversa tion avout the new paper? A. That was a cone Ver-ation somewnere aovut the 12th or 13ta, and tulsa was Peoruary, just beiore the 7th, Evarts (aside)—Now these letters, what are toe numbers of trem? We have got them here on the notes—two oi them tere, 0 witnesi Now Mr. Beecher, there was ¢ ird letter of Mr. Tiltun to Mr, Mouitou, ry Seam 1 for devence—Uan | have those les ters Mr. Morris—What are the numbers? ine, ten, and eleven. Evarts—(snowing papers to witnessj— Please gay il those are the two ietters whica you wrote? A. Yes sir; that one (iudicating); tae ove to Mr-. Tiiton aisu. Q. Now here ig a tuird letter from Mr. Tiltom te Mr, Mouton of the Saweaate, Picase look at rhat and *ay Whether you Saw Lost at or ab ot the me Of 18 date or Waen \or tne frst! IT cac’t say certainly—thougn | tiiak—woetver | saw it tm mediately aiter vhat; there was no concurrent luterview foliowing tae Writing o: these lecters, Q. No Interview in whic. tue third was, you mean? A. No, sr. Q And your letters, your two lewer:, were written indevendentiy 0: seeing this? A, Yes, si Witucat seeing tuat at ail. Q, Tuis letter, Mr. Beecher to Mra. Tilton, beg*ns i Tals Way—"My dear Airs. [1itou, When I saw you ast, I DIDN'T EXPECT EVER TO SER YOU AGAIN, or to be alive many days. God was kiuder to me than were my own thougats! wheo was the last time, prior to this 7th Gav of Feoruary. had sean Mra, fulton? A. I seppose | naun’t see! her since the interview of December 30, Q Yes, well tnat is yourrec liction? A. That is my recouection Of tae purport of tuis opeuiag sentence. Q. And of the fact that you hadn’t seen beri A. Yes, sir. Q. Ald you used this expression, “When I saw you iast I didn’t expect ever to see you again, oF Ww be ative many days: woat Was there im your situation that led you to bave an impression OF that shortness oi your Wie? A. That was the ess of botn our lives, str; she looked to me like one aiready bespoken ior by God’s augels; 10 tne terrible triaito which L was suvjected, the flery gzcvemeny it didn’s seem to me I could jive jong. Q. And in that view it was of her life and yout badd feeltngs Unat you wrote that expression? A. es, sir. Q. In conctuding this letter, Mr. Beecher, you say, “This is sent with Tneodore’s consent, but he nad Dot read i: ;” was that a tact, as you understood | it, that Mr. Tilton fad not read tae letter? A. Yes, sir; lunderstood it so, but that close Was the suggestion of Mr. Moulton, I was going on to the next sentence—= you revura it to me oy his band’ Lam very nes: im tris wish for all our sakes, for your lee Ler OULNE NOt to be Sudject to even the chance miscarriage.” Was that clause the subject conversation betweeu you and Mr. Moulion io the reparation of the letver, or in devising tne let rr A. It was, Q. And was inserted in ——? A. It was a sag. gestion of his, whicn I carried out; I can give you the reasons stated q. Sraced by Mr. Moulton?’ A. Yea, Well, What did he say in that counection? A. 1 can’t g.ve you what he said; 1 can give you what he suggested. Q. Wet A, That elizabeth would hkely not re ceive the documents trom Mr. Tilton’s hand; the idea was if sne though: Mr. Tilton and I nad got Up this letter together it would not nave any im fueace with her, avd We had better suggest te her that he had not seen it, that i was my letter ana wae my judgmen’ Q, Aud (oat Was tne fact? A, That was the fact; at least s0 tar as! kaow, of (. And coed, a8 to the retarn of the letter, you leit ths letver witn Mr. Moulton? I gave the letter to Mr. Moulton lor disvosal, to be sent by Mr. Tilton, apparentis, Mr. Bexch—To be retarned by Mr, Tilton. Mr, Evarts—“Tols ts sept with Theodore’s con- sent’? A. Yes. How do you know or how were you advised astotiuat? A. Mr, Mouiton—that is, Mr. Tuto consented that I should wrire tue sett to bis Wie; that is the geueral design, but he dida’t see the lever, Q And it was through Mr. Moulton that you re- ceived thatinformuti n? A, Yes, sir. Q. chat Mr, Tilton conseuted und by his advice ‘this letier was written’ Yes, sir. . I velieve that is ull We need of those letters, Mr. Beecher, was—did you request of Mr. Mouliom to get Mr. Tuton’s permission to write th: letter? A. No, sit, Q, From Whom did the communication on that suoject first prvceea? A. Mr, Moulton was tne @n« Gincer Oo: the Whole proceeding. Q, Now, io regard ro any atrangement or agre mieut that you would not O14 any communication wiurMrs. Ticom, auy corresp. ce with M Tuton, how did that arise, 1 there Was anytui of toe kind? =A. Ai diun'c arite; there never was such arrangement. What Was said or done by you In that connee tion, si aayiuing? A. Laiways said it Was ao ie proper thing Jur me personally to act in this mate ter with Mra. Tilton; 1 Was of several uccasion® (it Was sugested a¥ 4 naiaeaitumyg by dir. Mowe | ton Chat ishouia see her) + 1 deci Q Wout was Sugdesved by Mi | Toad should bring my Indaruce vo Dene WOR é