The New York Herald Newspaper, April 3, 1868, Page 3

IMPEACHMENT, Trial of President Andrew Johnson for High Crimes and Misdemeanors. Additional Testimony for the Prosecution. Examination of General Emory, Colonel Wal- Jace, Congressman Ferry, William E, Chandler and Charles A. Tinker. Probability of the Testimony for the Pro- secution Being Closed To-Day. WASHINGTON, April 2, 1863, There was nothing particularly enlivening in the impeachment proceedings to-day. The usual audience, composed of almost the identical persons who have attended every day since the inauguration of the drama, occupied the galleries, The back seats were poorly patronized, and, in theatrical parlance, the house might be pronounced thin, The feminine element preponderated, as hitherto, but with less of a bright and beautiful exterior than was presented on the sunshiny opening day, last Monday. Karse- ner, the witness from Delaware, whose rustic humor diverted the dulness of the court yesterday, was expected by many to make a reappearance, and those who missed the comic part of the performance yesterday afternoon hoped to be regaled by some- thing equally good provided the Solon Shingle of Delaware was introduced on the boards a@ second time. At the instance of the Attorney General the face- tious Karsener was recalled, and the renown of his homor having gone abroad everybody looked for- ward to a good old time, just as enjoyable as the performance of “Everybody’s Lawyer” and “the barril of apple sass.” But Karsener got no chance to gratify the eager fancy of the -expectant listeners, and in consequence there was no outburst of mirth, though the predis- position of the audience to laugh was so great that the least expression bordering on the serio-comic would have brought down the house. Mr. Stanbery elicited from Karsener, after a briéf interrogatory, that he called on Secretary Stanton after his interview with General Thomas, and of course the inference was that he detailed to the functionary of the War Department the character of his conversation with the Secretary ad interim. Mr. Ferry, from Michigan, member of the House, testified ina somewhat similar manner to previous witnesses the nature of the interview between ‘Thomas and Stanton, and then General Emory made his appearance as the grand prop of the tenth article of impeachment. Emory has ordinarily a pretty blu, vigorous voice, but on this occasion he spoke his part in a wonderfully subdued tone, so much so that several anxious Senators had to request of him to elevate his enunciation to a higher key, which he managed to do in the end after consid- errabie effort. Tiere was nothing new or striking in Generai Emory’s evidence beyond the statement that he recommended to the Presideut the retention ef more troops here in Washington, on account of the threatening aspect of the militia in Maryland, from which it might be inferred that Emory w apprehensive of a raid on the capital by the chi rous organizations of the adjoining State. General Butler has monopolized all the honor and glory of conducting the drama so far, and has lite- rally been the manager of the affair, to the exclusion of the ambitious Logan, the modest Bingham, the Don-asserting Wilson and Boutwell, the good-natured Willams and the practically defunct Thad Stevens, Butler has strutted his hour on the stage with a prominence and seif-assertion eminently character- istic. He has handied the witnesses most cavalierly, and conducted things generally just as he pleased, To-day, however, he caught a Tartar in the person of Colonel Wallace, of the Twelfth infaniry. The Colonel is the very beau ideal of a soldier, straight as a ramrod, well built, and while giving his tesii- mony stood as if on parade. Butler questioned him asto the business he had with Colonel Moore, the President's Private Secretary, on the night of the 22d of February. Wallace replied that Colonel Moore seut for him to say that his nomination for brevet Promotion had been set aside by the Senate, Butler ‘Bald that he had testifled before the committee that Moore told him he was rejected by the Senate, and be wished to know why he had changed tle expre: sion now and used the phrase “set aside.” Wal ‘with an immovable countenance, 109k *i-a moment sternly at Butler, and on, in a cl ar, ringing response, said he Was gt perfect liberty to use what- ever phraseoloz¥ je pleased. His manner was an unmistak%ple rebuxe of Butler's impudent catecheti- eal style of examining witnesses, and was highly “pppreciated by the audience, who felt something like an impulse to applaud. William FE. Chandler, recent Assistant Secretary of the Treasury, followed, and gave his testimony very well and clearly. Butler created a good deal of merry surprise by his answer to the question of the counsel as to the relevancy of Chandler's evidence, by stating it w the object of the prosecution to make it appear that Cooper was appointed in Chandler's place in the Treasury to co-operate with Thomas by honoring his warrants from the War Department. Chandler testified that no warrants could be issued by the Assistant Secre- tary without the cognizance and approval of the Secretary of the Treasury. The last witness to-day was Mr. Tinker, who had charge of the telegraph office in the War Department, and sent a despatch from the President to Lewis FE. Parsons, Governor of Alayarma, enjoining upon him the duty of acting in stret ordance with the con- stitution, The counsel for the defence langhed a good deal over this makeshift to prove a “high crime and misdemeanor, nd Butler himself seemed to appreciate the ridiculousness of the evidence, be- cause he made a laine and blundering eifort to give it a color of importance On the whole, the evidence of to-day, to any im- partial observer, was very feeble and watery, and ‘uniess the Managers do betier Thad Stevens linseif will denounce the whole thing as an unmitigated bore. The Board of Managers on the part of the Honse of Representatives expect to close the examination Of witnesses on the side of the prosecution to- Morrow, unless some objections raised by the other side occasion unexpected delay. It is Understood that as soon as they. will have com- pleted their testimony the Managers will make an effort to increase those of their number to take part in the argument. It is said they will ask for five, and probably the whole Board, If this be agreed to the entire counsel for the President will aiso participate. At present it appears that Mr. Curtis will open the case on the part of the defence, Tn the event of the Managers realizing their expecta- tons of closing ‘o-morrow ‘he defence will make an fort to postpone further action until Monday next, PROCEEDINGS OF THE COURT. Seventh Day, Unitsp State ty) Wash ‘ ‘Tie Scaate met at twelve o'clo chair Was bomediabely v I fe he Chief Justice, who said, “The Serrean prociamation.? ‘The Sergeani-at-Arms mole proclamation in due fori. at-Arms wil open the court by Ar ten minutes past twelve the Managers were announced and took their places, and immediately following about a doze rsof the House of Representatives, ‘The journal was then read. Mr. DRAKE, immediately afior ihe reading of | fournal was concluded, rose and saids—Mr Pre dent, Teeud to the chair and ask the adoption of an amon! nt to The Seo wwEABY read the ninendment ag follow NEW YORK HERALD, FRIDAY, APRIL 3, 1868.—-TRIPLE SHEET. all such questions the votes shall be without a divi- Sah ophas eceamra nana Sk pricy tl mem! omcen, when the same shall be taken.” At the suggestion of Mr. Dkake rule. seven was read. As proposed to be amended it provides that the Chief Justice shall rule upon all questions of evidence aud incidental questions, &c., in the first instance, Mr. HENDRICKS—I suppose by the rules it stands over for one day. The Caier Justice—If any Senator objects, Mr. CongLING—Under what rule ? A brief colloquy ensued between Messrs. ITENDER- SON and CONKLING, inaudible in the Reporters’ Gal- lery. Mr. STANBERY, Of counsel for the President, then rose and said:—Mr. Chief Justice, before the Managers proceed with another witness we wish to recall for a moment Mr, Karsener, Mk. BurLer, of the Managers—I submit that if Mr. Karsener is to be recalled, the examination and cross-examination having been finished on both sides, he must be recalled as a witness of the respon- dent, and the proper time to call him will be when they begin their case. Mr. StanBERY—We will call him but for a mo- ment. The Caer Justice (to Mr. Butler)\—Have you any objection to his being called? Mr. BUTLER—NO, sir. George Karsener took the stand again. Question by Mr. STANBERY—Mr Karsener, where dia you stay that night on the 9th of March when you had had this conversation with General Thomas? A. I stayed at the house of Mr. Tanner. TESTIMONY OF THOMAS W. FERRY, MEMBER OF CON- GRESS. Mr. Thomas W. Ferry, a member of Congress from Michigan, was next called, and, being sworn, was ex- amined by Mr. BUTLER, as follows:— Q. Were you present at the War Ofice on the morn- ing of the 22d of February, when General Thomas came there? A. I was. Q. At the time when some demand was made? Yes. . Q. State whether you patd attention to what was going on there, and whether you made any memoran- dum of it? A. I did pay attention, and I made a Memorandum of the occurrences so far as I observed them. Q. Have you that memorandum with you? A. I have. ‘3 Q. Please state, assisting your memory by that Memorandum, what took place there, in the order, as well as you cap, and as distinctly as youcan? A. The memorandum covers the occurrences as dis- tinetly as T can possibly state them; I wrote it im- mediately after the occurrence, and it is more accurate and perfect than I can state from memory. Mr. BurLer—Unless objected to, you may read it, ‘ANEERY—We shall make no objection, The witness then read the memorandum as fol- lo w8:— A. WAR DEPARTMENT, SHINGTON Ciry, Feb, 22, In the presence of Secretary Stanton, Judge Kel- ley, Mr. Moorhead, General Dodge, General Van Van Horn, Mr. Delano’ and Mr. Freeman At twenty-tive minotes to twelve Adjutant General Thom me to the office of the Secretary ying “Good morning.” The Secretary ré- i Then looking around to disturb these gentie- men, and T will wait.” The Secretary replied, ‘Nothing private here, sir; what do you want?? homas demanded of Secretary Stanton to sur- ler the Secretary of War Ofice. Stanton denied ‘Thouas said, it to him and ordered him back to his own soflice as Adjutant neral, ‘Thomas re- fused to go, and said, “I claim the ofice of Secretary of War, and demand it by order of the President.” Stanton—*I deny your anthority to on that order, and I order you back to your ow office.” Thomas—“T will stand here. T want no unpleasant the presence of these gentlemen.” Stanton—* stand there if you please, but you cannot retary of War, Tam Secretary of War, and order you to get out of this ofMce to your own.”? Thomas—“T refuse to go, and I will stand here.’ Stanton—“How are you to get pos: session? Do you mean to use force?” Thomas—"T don’t care to use force, but my mind is made up as af Tam to do. 1 want no unpleasant- I shail stay here and act as Secretary of Stanton—"You shall not. 1 order your superior, back to your own Thomas—“T will not obey’ you, but here.” Stanton—“You can stand here if you out of this office to your secretary of War.” Thomas then went into an opposite room, crossed the hall to Gen- eral Sciriver’s of ice, and commenced ordering Gen- chriver and General E. D. Townsend, § “a, followed by Moorhead and Ferry, these oficers not to obey or pay ar tion to Thomas, He said, “1 deny his autho Secretary of War ad im, and forbid obecience to his directions, [am Seeretary of War, and 1 now orces you out of this oMce to your own oitce,”? Thoma “T shall not go; I shall discharge the fune- tions Secretary of War.” Stanton you will ” Thomas—*T shall require the employ¢s of tie War Department to deliver to me the mails, and shail transact the business of the office.” Stanton—*You shail not have them, and I now order you to your own office.”? Cross-examination by Mr. StANRE Q, Did the conversation stop there? A. So far as Theard it did, + Q. You then left the gmce? AL} id; Left: Gene Tat Thomas in General Schriver’s room and returned to the Secretary of War's room; the Secretary of War remained fora few moments im General Schriver’s room and then returned to his o-¢n roo Q. How early on the morning of the 224 did you go to the omice of the Secre.ary of War? A. My tne pression is it was about a quarter past cleven o'clock in the morning. Q. Had you been there at all the night before? I hag not been, The storm Which passed over the city made the hall so dark thatthe gas had to be lighted at this point. Tbe testimony was thea resumed:— Q. Did you hear the order gi y General Thomas in General Schriver’s room? A. Yes, sir. Q. Were you in General Schriver’s room at the time? A, [believe | was the first who followed Mr. Stanton into Sehriver’s room, and Mooriead came second, TESTIMONY OF GENERAL EMORY. Genera! William H. Emory sworn and examined by Mr. BUTLER. qQ. What is your rank and your command in the 1 nel of the Fifth cavalry and in the army; wy command is of Washington. as ” , the Departme ‘. How long have you been in command of t depertment? A. Since the Ist of September, 1s @. Soon after you went into command of the de- partment did have any communication with the President of the United States as to the troops in the tor (heir stations? A. Yes. . » proceeding to give that coversa ate the extent of the Departme —its territorial limits, A. ‘The Departmen: shington consists of the District of Columt and Delaware, excluding Fort Delaware ate as well as you can, and if you cannot give it ail, the substance of your coversation which 3 had with the President when you first entered onthe command, A. It is impossible for me to give thing like the coversation; [ can only give the ce of it; it occurred jong ago; he asked me about the location of the troops, and | told him the strength as nearly as T could recollect, the commanding officers of (he posts. Q. Goon, A. That Was the substance and impor- tani part of the conversation; there was some con- versation as to whether more troops should be sent here or not, | recommending that there should be more troops here, and referriag the President to the report of General Canby, my predecessor, recom- monding that there should be always at the seat of yvernment at Jeast a brigade of infantry, a battery © squadre ‘alry; Some Con- «1 with reference to the formation in Maryland, which was then a military for going on. Q. What military fore by the State of Maryland, Q. Please stote as nearly as you ‘can what you said to the President in substance relative to the forma- tion of that military force? A. 1 merely stated that T could not see the object of it, and that 1 did not like the ion, and saw ho n ity for it, Q. Did you » what your objecttous were to the organization? think it likely that I did, butt cannot ree actly at this time what they were: 1 think ii likely that stated that they were clothed of sive to our people—so were oificered by gen- n who hod been in the Southern army. Q. By offensive uniform do you mean gray? A. ey A. The force organized 4). Do von recollect anything else at that time? A. Notiinyt else. (Di your ow were you It at that time upon the President at estion and of your own accord, or A. 1 was sent for. en again did he send for you for any such A. 1 think it was the of February. t manner did you receive the message? A. J received a note from Colonel Moore, ‘olonel Moore? A. He is private Secre- dent and an onicer in the army. ‘) Have you that notery A. J have not; it may be in mny desk, al the onic Did you produce 1! f the House of from tt " note before the Gommit- preseatatives? A, 1 read “ At hole as copied in tia A. I have. ling paper to witness) a correct copy. A. Itis Tit. 8 read as follows Exroutive Ms Wasi WN, Fels, 82, ‘ Geere othe President d ibe please it ve Pape rs Ie. . Pleas The witn . How early did you call? A. I called immedi- 9. ‘How early in the day? A. I think it was about midday Q. Who did you find in the President's room? A. I a the President alone. Aaa . State as nearly as you can what place there? A. I will try and ‘state the substance of it; the words I cannot undertake to state exactly; the President asked me if I recollected the conversation he had with me when I first took command of the department; I told him I recollected the fact of the conversation distinctly; aud he then asked what changes had been made; I told him no material changes, but such as had been made I could state at once; I went on to state that in the fall six companies of the Twenty-ninth infantry had been brought to this city to winter, but as an offset to them that four companies of the Twelfth infantry had been de- tached to South Carolina on the requisition of the commander of that district; two companies of artillery had been detached by my prede- cessor; one of them, detached for the purpose of aiding in putting down the Fenian dificulties, had been returned to the command, and that although the number of companies had been increased the numerical strength of the command was very much the same, growing out of the order reducing the artillery and infantry from the maximum of the war establishment to the minimum of the peace estab- lishment, The President said, “I do not refer to these changes.” I replied that if he would state to me the changes he referred to, or who made a report of the changes, perhaps I might be more explicit. He said, “1 refer to the changes within a day or two,” or something to that effect. I told him that no changes had been made; that under a recent order issued for the government of the army of the United States, founded on the law of Congress, all orders had to be transmitted through General Grant to the army, and in like manner ail orders coming from General Grant to any of his subordinate officers must eeracead come, if in my department, through me; that if by chance an order had been given to any junior officer of mine it was his duty at once to report the fact, The President asked me, “What order do you refer to?’ I replied, “Order No. 17, in the series of 1862. He stated he would see that order, and @ messenger was despatched for it. At that time a gentleman came in who, I supposed, had business in no way connected with the business which I had in hand, and I withdrew to the further end of the room. While there the messenger came with the book of orders and handed it to me. As soon as the gentleman had withdrawn I returned t> the President with the book in my hand and stated I would take it as a favor if he would permit me to call his attention to that order, that it had been passed in an hg Srp bill, and that 1 thought it hot unlikely it had escaped his attention, He took the order and read it and observed, “This is not in conformity with the constitution of the United States, which makes me mmander-in-Chief, or with the terms of your coinmission.”’ Senator Howarp called upon the witness to repeat his language. Witness—He said, “This is not in conformity with the constitution of the United States, wh! makes me Commander-in-Chief, or with the terms of your commission;” I replied, “That is the order which you have approved and issued to the a government,” or something to that eft collect the exact words, nor do I pretend to give Xact words of the President of the United ; the President then sai mT to understand I cannot give an order except through the ¢ eral of the army, or through neral Grant?” T said in reply that was my impression, and that was the the army entertained, and that L thought the army was on that subject a unit; ay think it only fair, Mr. President, to when this ‘order came r discussion on the subject as ere the obliga- ader the order, and some emi- re consulted; | myself consulted one, and the opinion was given me decidedly, not equivo- cally, tat we were bound by the order, constitu: tional or not constitutional.”’ . Did you state to him who the lawyers were who had been consulted ? A. Yes, Q. What did you state on that subject? A, Well, perhaps in reference to that a pari of my statement was not altogether correct; in regard to myself I Robert J. Walk tt said to the President, whether A. T stated that 1 had consuit- ed Mr, Rob J. Walker in reply to his question as to who it was that was consulted and that f wader. stood other ofticers had cousulted Mr. Reverdy Joimson. Q. Did you say to him what opi giveu by those tawyersy A. 1 whom I consuited Stated to me that we were botnd by it undoubtedly, and that 1 une pod from some ollicers who, L suppe i, had consulted Mr. Johnson it he was of the ee opition. Q. What did the President reply to that? A. The President said the object of the law was event : then the conversation ended by my thanking ht for the courtesy with waich he had allowed me to ex- press my own opinion. Q. Did you then withdraw? 1 then withdrow, Q. Did you see General Thomas that morning, A. Thave no recollection of it. Q. State whether this paper is an oMciat copy of the order to which you refer. A. No, sir; itis only @ part of the ord the order whieh | had in my hand has the Appropriation bill in front of it; That is perhaps another form from the Adjutant General's one but it is the subsiance of the order—is a part of it. . Is it so far as it covers this matter? it concerns this matter it is th ame Copy, or, more y ly spcakinz, nm; there are two editions of the ins the wilole Appropriation bill, un Of the Appropriation bill, Q. Is this (handing the Wiluesss another paper) an oficial copy’ A. Yes, sir. Q. This, Lobserve, is headed “Order No, 15,” and you said the order was No, 17, Do you refer to the same as a different order? A, I refer to the su order; I think Order No. 17 is the one containing the Appropriation bill, and 1 think that is the one on fie in my office that made tae confusion in the first place; I said Order No. io or 17, but Order No, 17, 4 think, embraces the “ypropriation bill Mr. BUTLER (lading the paper to tks President's Y—Tus ly No. 16, and covers ihe seciton of nent m had been 1 thar the lawyer A. As far as same order, bnt it order: one col and this i 9 see Mr. EVARTS said—Then we will treat this as Order No. 17, unless there should be a difference, Mr. BUTLER said there was no dilerence, and he read (he order #5 followsi-- i UENERAL ORDERS NO. Th. War DEVAwIMENT, ADJUTANT GENERAL'S OF WASHING PON, Mareb 12. 1 ‘The following extract from an ac of te 1 for the information and government of all concerned AU appropriason for the support of the her purpom if bished “Au my lor to, That the Readquar. y oi the Colied States shall be ofl orders an: ruetions relat. itary op far stall bef incase of his General pended or removed { to duty elsewhere than at the be: request, with the previous apy lieved, Fuse or assigned ptat his own the Senate; and reo tnetructions relating to military operations issued trary to the requirements of this section shall be null and tany oficer iseting an order or instructions contrary visions of this section shall be deemed gulity of @ al f the army who shall tion so tne that a years, on conviction of competent jurisuiction. Approved i the Seoretary of W ED. TOWNSEND, Aesistant J Q. You are still in corm jutant General. nd of this Department? xamined by Mr. Sv Yt Q. The payer whieh you hu ul whieh was read by the Presiient on that day, Was marked Order No. lit A. 16 orl Q. In that paper marked 15 was the whole Appro- PThition act printed and setout? A. Yes Q. In other respects it was like ts it was like that; te cups the Appropriation bill founded tem. my oft have con- om that the paper which you sident’s, or Which Was tead by you ut , is the same as Ute one in your ofice ¢ the President A. That is my Impression. _Q As Tunderstand you, when this document or No. 17 was sent to the Of a discussion amo a. 1 of the army there was A. Yes. ins No construc. tion of the but simply gives the act for their in- formation? A. That ts so. Q. On reading the act a discussion arose among the oflicers of the army? A. Yes. Q. As to its meaning, or what? A. A discussion with a view of ascertaining What aa ofiver’s obliga- tions under the act were, . Q. You had received no instrnetions from the War Departmentor where, ex pt what was contained in this document itself? A. None whatever, Q. It ieft you, then, to construe the act? A. Yea. Q. On that you sey, to settle your doubts, you ap- plied to an eminent lawyer? “A. T had no doubts mee a setile the doubts of others [ did. Q. And the gentleman to whom you applied wa Mr. Robert J. Wai A. ie raat 9 Q. Was it he who advised you that you were bound to ‘obey only orders given through General Grant, whether it was constitutional or unconstitutional to send orders in that way? A. The question of con- slitution was not raised: it was only a question whether we were bound by the order, Q Tunderstood you to say that the answer was “constitutional or unconstitutional’? A, ‘T J made @ mistake: my question was whether we were bound by itt 1 would like to correct that, Q. You said ina former answer that the advice Was that you were bound to obey the order, whether it was w litutional or not, until tt was decided? A. We had no right to judge of the constitution, Q. That was the advice you got? A, Yea, Q. Decided by whom and where? A, By the Su- preme Court; and not only that, but a new order would have to be promulgated making this null and vold and of no efi Q. When you said to the President that he app som N ed thing, did you speak in reference to that order, 17, Which cont the whole of the act? Did you mean to say that he had approved the order or the aet? A. So faras we were concerned the order and the act were the same thin hd if you will ob- — he : is marked “ approved,” that uleans by the President. Q. What t* marked “approved,” the order or the act? A. The act is marked approved: the order con tains nothing but the act, nol a word besides, Ne approval Was to the acty A, I rand the act the saine, t “approved” that you speak of is ) far as that is concerned the order aame things , » Managers, produced toned 1 jeateleopy of Gene ral by brevet, to rank as such from the 12th of Senator HeNDERSON—I presume the Senator de- March, 1865, for gallant and meritorous services at | sires to know whether the letter can afterwards be the battle of Cedar Creek, Va. Mr. Wilson read the order assigning General Emory to the command of Wi n, and continued:—We now offer the order under which General Thomas resumed his duties as Adjutant General of the Army of the United States, (Reading it.) We now offer the origina) letter of General Grant requesting the \- dent to put in writing the verbal order that he had given him prior to the date of this letter, th the letter and the order of the President are the original documents. (Reads the request.) On that letter is the following endorse- ment—(reading the endorsement by the lent made in compliance with the request). The next document which we produce is a letter written by the President of the United States to General Grant, of date February 10, 1868, _ It is the original letter, I send it to the counsel that they may examine it, Senator Howarp—Is that an original? Mr. WiLSON—Itis the original, Mr. STANBERY (after examining {t)—Mr, Chief Justice, it Bppears that this isa letter purporting to be a part of the correspondence between General Grant and the President. IT ask the honorable Managers whether it 1s their intention to produce the entire correspondence? Mr. WiLsoN—It is not our intention to produce anything beyond this letter which we now offer. Mr. STANBERY (returning the letter)—No other part of the correspondence but this letter? Mr. WILSON—That is all we propose now to offer, Mr. STaNBERY—I wish the honorable Managers to state what is the purpose of introducing bis letter. What is the object? For what charge? Mr. WILsSon—I may state, as the especial object for the introduction of this letter, that it is to show the declaration of the President as to his Intent to pre- vent the Secretary of War (Mr. Stanton) resuming the duties of the ofice of Secretary of War in defi- ance of the Senate, Do you desire it read? (To Mr. Stanbery.) Mr. STANBERY—Yes, of course. Mr. WILSON read the letter, which is that in which the President enclosed tl testimony of his Cabinet on the question of Sealey between himself and General Grant, and which Wilson did not read. Mr. STANBERY—I have asked the honorable Man- ager if he has read all that he intends to, In that letter certain letters were reterred to of which it is explanatory. Do you propose to read them? Mr. WILSoN—Ali have been read that we propose to offer. Mr. STANBERY—You do not propose to offer the papers and documents that accompany that letter ? Mr. Wiison—I will state to the counsel that we offer a letter of the President of the United States. We proposed to offer it, have offered it and it is in evidence. That is the entire evidence. \BERY—We ask that the documents re- read that accompany it and explain it. Mr. WILson—We olfer, sir, nothing but the letter, If the counsel have anything to offer when they come to muke up their case we will consider it then, Mr. STANBERY—Suppose there were a postscript ? Mr. Witson—There is no postscript, though. (Laughter,) Itis there as written by the President, Mr, STANBERY—We Will ask a ruling upon that On the first page of the letter the matter 1s ch L will read. (He read portions of sizing the President's quotations from General Grant's letter referring to a former letier of the President as containing many gross mis- statements; also the portion ug to the letter enclosed, saying he lett the K for them- selves, without comment. — ‘aubery con- tinned, is the answer to the st Mr. WiLson—I suppose the that this is not the letter, eon propose to offer now. ‘This | Mr. SraNBewy—We subinit ement. will not claim at is all we is in evidence. the gentlemen are objection is too late now; if it the proper time. The letter is sub- been read and is in evidenc JUSTICE made a statement, inaudible to lat e, that ation made by tie P assumed that the Jette Mr. BINGHAM—We desire to state, Mr. President, * not aware of any obligation, by any rule of evidence whatever, in this w accused to adinit in e itten statement of Uv the statements re to generally him in’ that written statement of third person. in the frst place, their evidence, would not be evilenc Against the it they world not be the pariies auld, The ind tothe Pr asked to produce I fact between hiinss tion of fact, as assumed by” Ut aud ior himself, and if forty memby rwise tie could no Iis his own d wetween hims hey would be hearsay st evidence of whi contained tat pers which we 1 10 & question of al Grant, This ques- ras the President is concerned, is resident in this letter, by himself micludes hin; and Wwe insist re to unite it concludes atter of dis nt, and that no part of the usition againse rely upon it. Mr. BincuamM—Of course, the gentiemen rely upon Kus to read almatter which is ho p: enee at all. Ibis not the highest evidence, he testimony of the members of @ inatier of fact, and--as 1 Y aut nts is aterial fact that, so far as they are conc 1 unsworn testi B is « onipetaae Judinit that if tie recording to the shitement, Were showa—a ft adopted by (he President in regard to the of the charges—it would be a diferent ques- tion; that it would take tt then rules of evidence; bat anybody that is not the point it is nel competent 2 the statement gp tiny oiticer what- i ever; Uh ie flas not_any Heaing Upon the Mtr NSw reat io show that his purpoxt TAs lo prevent the execution of ure of Ouiee law and prevent the Secretary of , after being coufirmed by the Senate, and the appointment of Thomas being non- concurred in, from enteriag upon and forthwith p forming, as the Jaw requires, the duties of his ot That is the point of this letter. We introduce it he purpose of showing the President's We say that in every point of view, oiered for the reasons LE have statements are forei.n lothe ase and we are under no obligation to introduce them, and in iny judgwent have no right ty introduce th Mr. Eyanis—Mp, Chief Justice ee “k—Hf the counsel for the Presi- 2etion to writine, Mr. Curt read if, as follows:-- “The counsel for tue President object thal the letter fs not in evidence in the case unless the honovabie Managers shail also read the enelosnres therein ¥ ved to, aud by the latter jaake part of the same. Mr. SYANBERY— Honor or before th The Cire dustick—it is before the court, sir. Mr. STANBERY—If the Mana read a letter from the President to use against Hin certain statements that he made in it, and perhaps the whole, ail do not know the object. ‘They say tr is to prove a eel infe@t with regard to the exclusion of Mr. Stan wat letter the President has reierred to¢ itas throwing light upon the ing his own views. Now, i put it the ait question now before your Ld e letters himself Leaid, istas he art of iny corn that, aithough they came rem other person Nn, If lie choo: use them as explanatory of his lever? He ajoug with the letter certain explanatory matiers, and lie took the trouble of referring: to them in. the body of | them ro it, an exhibit, ati tupe or seal, or other: sheuld they Hot be real asa part of the com- munieation—as the very mutter whieh is introduced as explanatory, without whieh he is not willing to introduce that letter’ Certainty. Is tt not fair to read With I the letters that are a part of ity It seems to me tat they must read the whole of what the Senators. Suppose he had copied th detter ou to thy in the body of th here, “L reser y invnication ' hes them to ihe President said in order to give bis views, not merely the letter, M The Managers do not suppress an this mT proper depart o by the I which, it is tue, atements wie by Members of the Cabinet touchhug a question of veracity pending between the President and Gen- eral Grant, Now we insist Unit that question has nothing to do with this case, K thing contained in the letter which can, by any possi 1 sidered as the ¢! sof the case offeriag the letter itself, and the statem Pre uit referring to the Hi enclosures show that those enclosures relwie exclusively to that question f veracily pending between himself and General rau!, and are in no wise connected with the quex- tion between the Preside nt and the representatives of the per The Ciike JUSTICE stated the case, not so as to be heard by the reporters, hoy Mr. WILSON--We expec roper purpose conn We er. t use the letter for any cled w iti the issues of the case. 1 the whole of it, dustick—The Chair wll put the question to bration of the Senate. wor CONKLING—1 oiter the Yollowing request. is for the reading of the Howe journal relict by the coum ecretary ithe request as tullows:— “The counsel for the respondent wilt p read the words in the letter relied upon touccing We eu closure. Mr. SPANBERY read it, a8 follows: tAL—The extraordinary character of your fet fof Would seem to prelude any reply on my p. Mts nner in which publiciy has been sven to the oo.% 0 were pres tion on the Math ult, pplen of the let siuressed to me upon bet pasroneed v @ Subject are avcurdingly The CHike Justtor stated the queation. Mr. PRELINGHUYSEN called for the yeus Which were ordcved, ; Senator Dkakr—f desire to ask whether, if Jecvion is alued, it has the eect of ruling oul te letior altogetiver? The CHIRK Justi In reply to a qui Crier JUsticn stat t yr Anthony, the fan aifirmative tthar tir WSiaine th sir, Q. And then you went in to see the President ? Tdid. ft went in at my own request. Q. After you bad passed the usual salutations wat was the first thing he said to your the read as evidence if the objection should be sustained, The Cuter Justice—It will exclude only the letters. ‘The yeas and nays were then called with the fullow- ing result:— si Yras—Messrs. Bayard, Conkling, Davis, Di: Doolittle, Fowler, Grimes, Hendersi, Tende ens Jol any Mereery, oy, Noo - pragi ‘Trumbull, Van'Winkle, Vickers and Willey Bo. si Navs—Messra. Ant » Buckalew, Cameron, Cattell, Ghandier, Cole, Connes, Cofbett, Craciny Drake, Eamunde inden, 0, Morrih of Me. Nye, Facleraon ot wie Pomeree? Rowe rman, Stewart, Sumuer, ¥ Soecman, ty Sumner, Thayer, Tiptoa, So the objection was not sustained, Mr. WILSON—We now offer a copy of a letter of sppolnenans of the President, appointing Lorenzo Thomas Secretary of War ad interim, that is cer- tified to by General Thomas. I submit it to the counsel for examination, and call attention to one thing connected with it. We offer it for the purpose of showing that General Thomas attempted to act as Secretary of War ad interim. His signature is at- tached to that document as such. If we are not cailed upon to prove his signature, we will not offer any evidence for the purpose. He read the paper, a8 well as the following endorsement: — Oficial copy respectfully furnished to Edwin M. Stanton. L. THOMAS, Secretary of War ad interiin. Received ten P. M. February 21, Tse, Mr, STANBERY—That is in the handwriting of Mr. Stanton, _ Mr. BUTLER—That ig in the handwriting of Mr. Stantbn, Mr. Witson—We next offer copies of the order re- moving Mr. Stanton, the letter of 2uthority appoint- ing General ‘Thomas, with certain endorsements thereon forwarded by the President to the Secretary of the Treasury for his information, and submit After inspection by Stanbery and Curtis, Mr. WILSON asked—Have the counsel for the respondent any objection to the introduction? hey replied negatively, The papers were then read. TESTIMONY OF LIEUTENANT COLONEL WALLACE. nae W. Wallace sworn and examined by Mr. utler:— Q. What is ge rank inthe army? A. Lieutenant colonel, Twelfth infantry, commanding the garrison at Washington since August last. Q. What time in August? A. The latter part of the month; the exact day I do not recollect, Q. State if at any time you were sent for to go to the Executive Mansion about the 23d of February ? A. On the 22d of February I received a note from GEORGE W. Colonel Moore that he desired to see me the following | YY Prqpose to connect this testimony morning at the Executive Mansion. Q. Who is Colonel Moore? A, He 1s on the staff of the President and is an oMicer of the army. a Does he act as secretary to the President? A, T believe he does. Q. About what time of the night did you receive the note? A, About seven o’cloc’ Q. Was there any time designated when you were to call? A. Merely in the morning, Q. Did you go? A. Ldid, Q. What time in the morning? <A. About ten o’clock, Q. Did you meet Colonel Moore there? A. I did, Q. What was the business? A. ite desired to see me in reference to a matter relating to myself per- sonally. Q. How? A, Some time in December my name had been submitted to the Senate for brevet, The papers had been returned to the Executive Mansion, and on looking them over Cc el Moore was of the opinion that my name had bi set aside, His ob- ject was to notify me of t faet in order that T might make use of influence and have the matter rectified, q. Afterthat did he say anything about your seeing the Presidenty? A. TL asked mn how the President was; he replied, “Gery well, do you desire to. see hin to which I replied “Certainty,” and in the course of a minutes [ was admitted to the presen cutive. Q. Was a messe r sent in to know if the Presi- dent would see your A, That 1 am unable to answer, Q. Did Colonel Moore leave the room where you ‘conversing with him before you went in to see edident ? A, He left the room to bring out this ge of papers aud for no other object: that fata of, Q. Did he go into the ofice where the F was for that purpose? A. Yes, 4. He brought the sf your name appeared to ti @ , explained to peen rejected ¢ A A. sident asked me if any changes had been wi on Within a aheort tinny in moving the troops you mean the garvison of ‘ton’ A. Yes. Q. What did you tell him on Ghat subject? ported that four compaates of (i had peen sent to the Fifth district, that no other changes had Uv mention another company thought of. ‘oh Did lie ever send for yon on such an errand be- ore? wie in A, Tres Twellth iifantry nd that beyond on made, which 1 Lomitted to have since President had not ad his questi Did he ¢ Minto his room, either dire or intireetly, to put snel a qnestion as that before? the question had stat President w in orde Mr. it assumed his to witness the becanse d that the a, “Would you like tosee him inly, and went inte his r AKTS objected that inquiry « the how ain say that 1 assume one theory WT think the testimony was that by the procurement of the ue when Leome toit, But about that 1 will put te question Ishall leyin uever in th: utr A. Never. Q. Did he say to you anything on that subject as to ing asked the same question from com mander, General Emory, on (he previous day, ane of his having told him the same as youdid? AL No, sir. Did he speak of it asa thing which he did not “aly ? RTS suggested that the witness should state ssident said. Mr. ST. RY also objected to amination in chic amination which Was altogether tew to counse! Mr. BUTLER withdrew the question and asked, othing more. 0 vr. t you had been te word “re- iter; but f do not know that that was the aston, Whe come to reflect upon it, the words i by Colonet Moore were “set aside.” My own view of the matter Was that I had been reject, Q. Why do you change now on the stand the word * for the words “set aside VanTS—He does hot chin yerore. Tis yout i BeTLER—T understat t sl. Why Ho you now change he said the change sand, “wet with you do not think Colonel Moore us ‘A. Phave a perfect right to make w guage as f think proper as a witness, om tany mils. f Mr. Burien—Entirely so, sir: bat f onty ask A. My reason 14 to corr rd to the expre: it was tha why you use ti apprehension in re Moore. My own view ¢ rejection. He sid “set as Lthink. : Q. Did hem n of Cc Ke any difference between “set ¢ t that time? A. That ts a question tof. rivise you to nee In 17 vith Senators . to get yourself coufirn i Mr. Sranpeny asked what (hat question? Mr. Burirr satd he wanted to un ant by “rejec RECES The witness was not cro: for te 1 to do with the jerstand what the witness me ed, and (he court took a reces THADDEUS STRVENS. t r. Stevens, in attempting to hair, fell on the floor of (he Senate chamber, a! Senators ran to lis assistan vl lie appeared not to be rey Seve and helped him to aechatr. much hart. After order ¥ eral’ <a Mr. LER put in evidence the General Thomas to the Adjutant Gen. ont The order i# d Headquarters of we vF wary 14, 1868, and is as follows:— . THOMAS, Adjutant Genera :l~ itant directs me to say that the President es desires the corr of the t Adjutant 4 TOUK, 7 iONY OF W. EB. € William E. Cha ined by Mr. Burr revet Brig, ANDLEI. denere dA, 4. [believe you Were once Assistant Secre cary of the Treasury? A. T was. From what time to what time? 1868, till November 30, 1867, did you learn the office routine or practi money is taken frota the Treasury for t ment? A. I did. (2 State the steps by which it isd Treasury for the War Department ? ion of the Secretary of War on the War In A. By Sucre ‘Vreasury, Which requisition passes counting offlcers of the departin yj the honored by issue of a by the Secretary of the Tre uty, oo States Q. Plense state the account’ ing omcers (hrough whicl it passes? A. The 8 Treasury bas control of the we Several of the accountants in the C4 the war requisitions; the 8€ cond Audi and possibly others, Q, Please tra ptiment: A. My at requisit! on through enue. bas no! sist T assume noth- | meanson the part of the Presic t like position in reference | jc why ever objec ene snieetienenienieecnrainiashints ler was then sworn and egam- A. Fr’ jm June, . While in the discharge of the duties of «nat omce fe by which ae ase of the ‘awn from the requisi- ry of the vugh the ac and is then warrant cet . yhich the money is paid by the Treas eer at te United cord Copmtrotd or of the aud navy accounts, pass upon vn, the Third the War De- 3 Secretary of the Treasury a warrant for the payment of money would be issued, which would also pass Lary the office of the Comptroller, bel countersigned by him. Then it would pass into the office of the Register of the Treasury to be there regiepered. and thence to the Treasurer of the United tes, who on this requisition would issue his draft for the payment of the mouey. That is sub- stantially the though I am not sare that 5 ave stated the different steps of it perihero nF Would it to the Second Auditor frst? A, pe ite possibly the requialtion would go first to the Ff boa or Third Auditor and then to the Comp- roller, Q. 18 there any method known to you by which the President of the United States or any other person can get money from the Treasury of the United States, for the use of the War Department, except through a requisition of the Secretary of War? A. There Is not, Q. What is the course of issuing @ commission to an officer of the Treasury Department who has been confirmed by the Senate? A. A commission is pre- pared in the department and Signed by the Secre- tary; it is then forwarded to the President and signed by him; it is then returned to the Treasury Department, where, in the case of a bonded officer, it is held until his oath and bond have been Med and approved, In the case of an oiicer not required by Jaw to give bond the commission is held until he ualifies by taking the oath. It is my impression that that is the usual form, There are some officers of the Treasury Department whose commissions are countersigned by the Secretary of State instead of the Secretary of the Treasury. For instance, an assistant secretary’s has to be countersigned by the Secretary of State, and not by the Secretary of the Treasury, and I suppose the commiasion of the Secretary of the Treasury himself issues from the office of the Secre- tary of State. Q. Onthe 20th of November, 1867, was there any vacancy in the office of Assistant Secretary of the Treasury? A. There was not. Q. Was there a vacancy up to the 30th of Novem- ber? A. There was not, . Do you know Edmund Cooper ? ir. STANBERY asked the object of offering that testimony, Mr. LER replled—The object is to show one of the ways and means, described in the eleventh arti- cle, by which the President proposed to get control of the mon of the Treasury Departine and of the War Department. If the counsel has any other question to ask, Lshall be very glad to answer it. Mr, STANBERY—That is not a suilicient answer to the question, r. Be —It is suMicient for the time, VARTS—What part of the eleventh article do vith ? Bur_er—With both the eighth and eleventh artic th article says “that sald And: Johnson, unwindfal of the high duties of his offic and of his oath of omice, with intent unlawfully to control the disbursement of monays appropriated for the military service and for the Departinent of Wer,” did so and #0. One of his means for doing tt was to place his private se ary in the office of Assistant Secretary of the Treasury. 1 Assistant Se ary of the Treasury, as f understand it, is allowed by law to sign Mr. Evarts said the Ma re being no 8 propose to prove appoint Edmund Coppe is the idea is tt? We object to iis rel eighth article as to” the ele honorable court will remember answer ued that there were of ways and means or of atte; means whereby we could tions there beiog that in pursu: he mace on the 18th of August, 186" on the 2ist of February, 1863, at the city e District of Columbia, unto requirements of Xecution of the Tenure of Onttce act fete are that on the ssident did xivempt to Penure ob Quik riving means to prevent Edw wuing lis place in tl And now proof is overed here onstitation Stanton trom Department, eorts im November, nund Cooper as Assistant $ asury. We object to such provi ection 13 two ove ts thal petent; the other ts that the is not nt. It ts Said that the ings 18 too gi . if we were Lo find an indiet- ment al common [aw for a couspiracy and make the allegations too geveral, the only objection to that would be that it did’ not suficiently infggan the defendants what aet should be given tn Therefe ie drawn a8 was the indictment in- th giving one general ile counts, se-tng out specit 4 ture of specifications, so Unt i the pieader nim the specie acts the plea may neral court, We need not, b say, diseuss the question of pleadings. Ty question is, is (is testimony competent he dini- culty that rests in the mind of my lear Lon the otlier side is, that they €.4 everything about the 2istof February. ‘They se zist of February was only the ealmona: I formed long before, swer is set forth, ta) wit:—As a 2 Says that he determined then to get rid Tused the words yes- That may be subject to various things for nity criticism, Now, then, there ar the President to do." He must get control of the ar Ofice. But what good would that do it he could not get somebody in the Tre ment who would be his servant, nient upon his breath to answer the re n oof his pseudo oficer whom he might vint to the War Department and ti wre he be- arly. ‘The appomutment of Mr. Cooper aa As- at Secretary of the T sUry Was therefore a ent to get his han into the Treasury of the United States, Mr. Sulloch, the > We show t ary of the yal” Thomas interim. the ts ent took means to serve upon him an attested opy of his appointinent in order that he and Mr. Cooper might its tte learn tn that when tain t ing a Inan’s motives aad when Lai tracing his cours: Thave not a right to put in every aet that he de everything that comes out of my mouth as at part of ; f that is not sustained val of ni recogn rose in the before elyection there Ww. nsel i ad be at it wae were not set out in form, they could not be proved as overt acts. then was whether certain ot could be put i as testimony — to the animus with whieh the first set of speeches ' been made. Lord Bhenborous the di t no overt act . bie, it is a univer: t in evidel of tas coaduct to whieh itt 4 r be siven any p The counsel for the defence’ “y that it is not bal Liat 1 is not overt act.” Lord Ellenborough satd, whatever proceeds hot aman may be given in evidence show the untenuion with whieh he parly says re do ne root yh tions may be given in <P would not trouble the would not have troubled the Senat matier had it not been that there may bh iibelustering around this grand conspira » propose to prove if we are permitted to put in vidence. I ted to is, * Who it 1 Cooper ail the question. t 2 my friends do not seriously nea to object ‘e asked what you expected to 1 propo won of A the 30th of re a com: slow Hie: rT enure wut 18 whi a 1 Wish to call attention, The on of that act declares that the making, y, countersiening OF i} authority ity snot ti #ixtit signing and s egntit nn or ie sent officer Whosg removal u nt Ai be deemed a high misdemeanor ; t si oe unrot this letter of authority to Mr. Coope signing if he did not issue tt, and sulin if bi not sien it, there being nO Vaca and is a part of the grcat conspirac question we Will be allowed to io int ‘Mir, STANBERY said:—-We do not object so mneh to tne question as to Who Edmond Cooper tt but we } hus todo we hth se, at want to know what it what even (he ile Conper to the oilice of Assistant Secretary hay with the case, We want to know what the ap ment of Raman Coop for the plirpond of oa noney of the Treasury has to do with the ci ) tderstaad, che learned Manager to say that, the ‘oof he invends to make in regard to Edmund appointinent of Mr, Cooper and ts at violated the constitution and the Tenure y given us notice to come here f Representatives impeached the Presilen| 4 thing done in the removal of Mr. Ghaadle were removed, or in the appointment of MI | in his place, if he were appolated? The Me select one instance of What they cl tion of the constitution and of the act, and in reference to a tempor an officer during the recess of the Sent. the case of General Thomas, and iY Geucrd alone: a9 0 that, of course, we hav to its being given evideier have notice of it, and are to meet it, but as to any high re Y ip reference to the appe itinen! Managers a cause they 1 appoinunent of Edun! eretary has todo vine x = in ey chi nt to amen ihe subject Until now, and Lam notcw ae h4 a have No FiEDe 0 Meet. If they Chioo: courate!® the pr cuss in any ¢ ven ¢ Foie to pet a new artivie lounded it n sion, however, ib! that a requ (4) t Foie ee president ta appolitng Mr. e'ary of War Would Come tote eorerary of the | the Hiewsl act 0) sna let us have time to anawer asuTY and pass thro gh the Be Crary. amiee to : has to the ot the oi Ce of uta second Comptroll Or ine Treasury to egard to qual appoinen . for the ourpogs, of ascerMning ynether or p Wy in Mhatter not charged, That ts cnougl, appropt tation on which We draf i o1y pe made | Deer whieh the Managers are not aathort ed eon drawn. The requisition W Guid pass from t " have Mo such delegated authority 2, Comptrolier thre jon the c of the as ) n back to * (ie | <r TEs " yh 40 een CLD Math BD aaa —eet