The New York Herald Newspaper, December 12, 1860, Page 1

WTERESTING PROCEBOINGS OF ‘CONG RESS Another Speecb. from Senator Iverson on Secession. Speeches of Messrs. Cobb and Davis in the House. Refusal of the Honse to Excuse Members from Serving on the Select Committee. MR. HAWKINS STILL DECLINES TO SERVE. Mr. Toucey Appointed Secretary of the Treasury Ad Interim. ORGANIZATION OF THE CRISIS CONVENTION, &e., ee &e. OUR DESPATCHES FROM WASITINCTON. Wasurxatox, Dec. 11, 1860. ‘The action of the House today in refusing to accept the resignations of Mr. Hawkins, of Florida, by vote of ninety-five to one hundred and ten; Mr. Boyce, of South Carolina, and Mr. Morrill, of Vermont, is regarded as a determination on the part of the conservative portion of the House to submit to no excuses short of death or se rious sickness, in the solemn exercise of legislative du ties in this crisis. The sentiment is, if representatives decline serving on so important a comunittee as one which is to endeavor to devise and recommend measures ef reconciliation and harmony in the present dis- tracted condition of the country, they have no business to be in Congress, The proceedings to-day were more boisterous than any ‘@ay since the session commenced. The republicans are pushing through business as rapidly as possible when- ever they obtain an opportunity. Mr, Smith, of Virginia, in his conservative speech, drew out a shot from the republican camp in Wisconsin. The Senate debate to-day did nothing for good or ill, ‘Dut was listened to by the largest number of spectators in attendance this session. The feeling to-night is more prevalent thit the Com- mittee of Conciliation will present some measure calcu. Jated to restore 4 natural pulsation to the national heart. All the members speak confidently on the subject, and express a willingness to abandon all speechifying, and ‘Proceed at once to the important business in hand. The subject of employing a stenographer was considered, and it is believed the idea will be abandoned. It is understood that Mr. Humphrey, a member of the Crisis Committee from the State of New York, does not reflect the opinions of the members from the city of New York upon the grave snbjects committed to his charge. They aro unwilling that their constituents should, by implication even, de supposed to assent to his probable action fin the committee. In pursuance, therefore, of what they sup- pose to be the inclination and judgment of the city of New York, and of their own opinions, they have addressed and delivered to him certain recommendations of specific con stitutional amendments demanded for the country and ‘the permanance of its institutions, which they wish him to advocate and vote for in the committee. As the paper is an interesting one at this crisis, you will be furnished with a copy. It is signed by John Cochrane, Geo. Briggs Wm. B. Maclay, Thos, J. Barr, D. E. Sickles and H. F Clark, all the city members. A letter was received here this morning by A. J. Smith, our Consul at Laguayra, from two of the most extensive planters in Texas, and they assert that three-fifths of the people are for immediate secession. Iam permitted to make an extract from their letter:— Upon this subject our minds aro deliberately, fully and erably made up. We are for secession, disunion, civil war, pestilence; los of property of life, of anything you can imagine, rather than submit to the rule of Lin. coin, elected as he was by a purely sectional vote, and a8 he is, to a course of policy so ruinous to the ‘The “lone star’? is flying in every direction, and ‘we don't count the cost or consequences. There seems ‘to be a settied determination not to submit. A meeting of Southern politicians to consider the state of the country, is now being held in Vice President Breck inridge’s room, at the National Hotel. ‘The democrats from the Northwest have had several conferences relative to the present condition of political affairs. They generally take the position set forth in ‘Mesera. McClernand and Vallandigham’s speeches yes terday, namely, that the Union cannot be dissolved peaceably; that the Northwest will, under no circum stances, consent to be cut off from the Gulf of Mexico and the city of New York; that the government, whatever may be its faults, is of inestimable value. The leading idea is @ central government, embracing the Middle ‘Western and border slave States, but depending for ite consummation on future circumstances. Lieutenant General Scott will arrive here to-morrow. ‘The Dill whieh passed the House yesterday authorizing the issue of ten millions in Treasury notes, gives power to the Secretary of the Treasury to sell them at the mar ket rates, as the wants of the government may require, the bids to be invited by notice of ten days. ‘The Senate Finance Committee will meet to-morrow, for the purpose of considering the Treasury Note bill. It has pased the House. Two of the democratic memberr of this committes, Messrs. Toombs and Bright, are ab- sent, It is understood that Senator Hunter will attempt to amend it in several particulars, but it is believed that not only @ majority of the committee, but of the Senate. are in favor of passing it as it came from the House. ‘The pressure upon the Treasury is too great to admit of delay, Mr. Cobb to-day formally took leave of the President, the interview being pleasant and of a private character. ‘The Secretaryehip of the Treasury is still vacant. The President last evening tendered |t to Lawrence 0'B. Branch, member of Congress from North Carolina. Mr Branch addressed a letter to the President today declin ing it. The statement that it has been offered to Mr Guthrie is untrue, and what is more, it will not be offered him. Secretary Toucey is at present discharging t be duties, and for the present will continue to do so. ‘There is no doubt of the accuracy of my announcemen’ some days since that Mr, Trescott, Assistant Secretary © State, has submitted his resignation to the President, fe surmised, and with much probability, that Henry yard, who has occupied an honorable position in the d plomatic service, will be his successor. Many of the foreign ministers are present in the Senat» every day, and appear to take great interest in the de Bates which take place there upon the questions of ai? ‘union, secession, ke. ‘The Post Office Committee of the House met this morning to consider an overland mail bill submitted ty them by Mr. Colfax, chairman. After consultation they unanimously adopted the Dill, the detaile of which are ag follows:—That the Postmaster General advertise for proposals for carrying the @atire mail overland daily between St. Joseph, Missour) and Sacramento, California, by the Central route, from July, 1861, to July, 1865; Denver City and Salt Lake City ‘to be supplied weekly without extra charge—the amount not to exceed $800,000 per annum; letters and papers to be carried through by the conductors in twenty days, and «pamphlets, magazines and public docu ments in thirty days. Tho bill also authorizes temporary steamship service from New York to San Francisoo, at the rate to be paid to Commodore Vander- Dilt the present session. The service is to be subject to @iseontinnance on ninety days’ notice, and is to continue ‘until otherwise ordered by Congress, in case the faily overland mail contract if not taken within the sum limit- €4. The bill is to be reported to the House this week. ‘The Department of State received intelligence this morning announcing the death of Elisha K. Clark and ‘wife, formerly of Connecticut, who were drowned while Crossing a stream jn the vicinity of Talca, iu Chile, = me MORNING EDITION—WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 12, 1860. ‘The report relative to the difficulty between two South ern members of Congress; was on account of one calling the Governor of a State “a hoary healed old traitor.” ‘The phrase was not used toward the member who fvels aggrieved, or there might have been trouble between tho parties ere this. | Matters are assuming a more quiet appearance this evening, the fact that the committee of concili ition have met and organized being received with satisfaction in circles not violently opposed to any effort at accommo- | dation. | Wasinvatoy, Dec. 11, 1860. A desperate conflict is going on in the Cabinet to decide whether Mr. Guthrie or Mr, Holt shall suceved Mr. Cobb, The strongest influences have been brought to bear upon Mr. Guthrie to induce him, against his own interests, to telegraph here that he will accept the position. If he would do so, it is argued that the fact would give the greatest confidence to the financial world. ‘The Comptroller of the Treasury examined the law to- day justifying the President in appointing a Secretary of the Treasury @d interim, and Mr. Toucey has consented to officiate in that capacity until successor to Mr. Cobb is appointed, A simi lar position was assigned to a Cabinet officer un. der President Tyler, when Attorney General Le- gare was acting Secretary of State. This rules out Mr. Clayton from becoming acting Secretary of State, and | vpon the arrival of Mr. Guthrie, should he be appointed, | Mr. Peter G. Weshington will probably be restored to the place of First Assistant Treasurer, which he held under Mr. Guthrie in the Pierce administration. A statement is made here, and may be sent to the country, that Secretary Thompson has also re- signed his place in the Cabinet, I learn to- night that such is not the fact; but it has been intimated to him that the Governor of North Caro lina, Mr. Thompson’s native State, will tender bim the appointment of Commissioner to South Carolina, and in such an event, should the President take exceptions to hig serving in that capacity, Secretary Thompson will im- mediately resign and accept the Commissionership. It is considered by those who ought to know, quite likely that the Governor of North Carclina will select Mr. Thompson as the Commissioner. Mr. Keitt leaves here for South Carolina to-morrow, and the other members of the Congressional delegation from that State are expected to leave in about ten days. The House Perilous Committee of thirty-three met this morning, and organized by the appointment of Mr. Cor- winas chairman. The House subsequently authorized the appointment of a clerk, and granted leave to the com- mittee to sit during the sessions of the House. It being understood that Mr. Haskin introduced his forty per cent reduction of the public printing at the last session under a misapprehension of the facts in regard to what the profits of that business would be, his action in the House to- bas astonished those who are the best acquainted with the facts. I learn from Mr. | Ford’s attorney and agent that Mr. Haskin had stated to-night that when he made his epeceh | he was not aware that Mr. Ford was sick | in Ohio, and had never neglected or refused to execute the public printing under the forty per cent reduction. It is expected that Mr. Haskin will to-morrow, or at some early day, introduce a resolution to reduce the profits forty or fifty per cent on the binding of the House, it being a much more profitable branch of the public busi- ness than the printing. Mr Haskin accidentally over- looked this at the last session. TREASURY ESTIMATES FOR THE ENSUING YEAR, TREASURY DkttARTMENT, Noy. 91, 1880, Sm—Agreeably to the joint resolution of Cor Jan. 7, 1846, Ihave the Bonor to transmit, for mation of the House of Representatives, printed esti- mates of tho appropriations proposed to be made for the !yoar en“ ug June 30, 1862, as follows, viz.— Forgan pllaneous, includ- oT collecting the revenue from sales of pub lands ant expenses of courts. .. -$10,462,511 25 To supply deficiencies im the revenues of the general Post Oth 5,312,175 63 Pensions. . 1.082000 00 Indian Department. 2,077,695 38 Army proper, &¢,, including’ miscellaneous objects...” Military Academy. Fortifications, ordnance, &c 13,710,759 02 184,337 00 imates arc tatements showing — 1. The appropriations estimated for the service of the fiseal year ending June 30, 1862, made by furmer acts of Congress, of @ specific and indefinite character, as ful- OWS, ViE— Migcellaneous, including expenses of collect- ing revenue from customs,......... 04+ Compensation to the general Post Office for mail services..... 5 sees Arming anc Civiligation of Indians. $5,220,014 14 2. Th which will be un are required for the tof the liabilities of the pre- sept fiscal year, but which will not be drawn from the ‘Treasury until ‘after June 30, 1861, and the balance ap- plied to’ the service of the fiscal year ending June 30, 1862, viz:— Civil list, foreign intercourse and miscella- Interior Department (pensions and Indian). 1,068,787 33 War Department Sctee . cesses 2,652,000 00 Navy Department . 2,636,885 87 198,112 62 by the statement of the estimated balances ‘ia tions which will be unexpended on » the sum of $444,699 13 may be carried to there are sundry papers: nations in rs to them. _ —, It appears: the above statement that the annual ant n jations required for the service of the fiscal year ending June 30, 1862, exclusive of the in- terest on the public debt, amount to $52,670,141 43. I am, very respectfully, your obedient servant, HOWELL COBB, Secretary of the Treasury. Hon. Wi1am Pewsixetos, Speaker of the House of Re- Presentatives of the United States, of exint June 30, 1) A coempenring Ge caljentes. cst ished by the several furn: THIRTY-SIXTH CONGRESS. SECOND SESSION. ite. Wasmotoy, Dec. 11, 1860. ‘THE TREASURY NOTE HILL. The House bill to provide for the payment of outstand- ing Treasury notes and authorize a loan, &., was taken up after some remarks from Mr. Rice, (opp.) of Minn., against, and Mr. Cawknow, (rep.) of Pa., in favor. Mr. Rick moved its reference to the Committee on Finance. The bill was referred to the Committee on Finance. OMY IN THR ARMY. Mr. Hats, (rep.) of N. H., offered a resolution that the Committee on Military Affairs be instructed to inquire whether the expenses of that branch of the public ser. vice cannot be reduced without detriment to safety, and that if they cau they be further instrycted to report to what extent and what particular branch or branches can be dispensed with or reduced, ‘The resolution was adopted. THR FINAN@! ALACIEME OF THR LAST seat, ‘The following ts the vote on the motion to take up the House bill from the last session. The bill provides for the payment of outstanding treasury notes, to authorize a joan, to regulate and fix the duties on imports, and for other purposes :— AnuurtMesere. Bright, Cheenat, Clay, Hammond, Jobn ory, Mason, Rice, Sebastian, Tuombs—10. Chandler, Clark, Collamer, Crit Dixon. Doolittle, Diu kee, Fessenden, Foot, Foster, Grimes, Yale, Hamiin, King, Seward, Simmona, Sumner, Pen Eyck, Trumbull, Wade Wilkinson, Wilsn—29. ‘The rest'of the Senate voted nay—27. THE SCR AP ERCH OF MR. RIGTAR When the resolutions relative to the secession portion of the President's ra.” were taken up, of Pa., took the foor from yeeter. Mr. Becurn, (opp. day. He said—It was my intention yesterday to indicate question which has agi my own position on the great tated ‘the people of this country, This is my only pur. pose this morning. At some subsequent period I propose to discuss the question more fully. Sir, it wae truly re: marked by the Senator from Mississippi, who eat next to me yerterday, that onil times aed fallen Ly hb, I regret to say, too apparent great republic Of cure tin imminent danger of dissolution. ‘The whole social, political and corumercial system is seriously dis ordered, and shows unmistakeable evidence of depression ‘apd distresr, Commerce ftrade and finance are deranged. ‘The banks have ceased to redeem their notes specie, and the of the United States is unaole to meet ite current demands. A general gloom is greed over the entire country. Why is all this, sir? Have the great elements of prosperity and progress suddenly been ex haueted? No, These were never more abundant than now. What i it, then, sir? Why, sir, dinguire it as we may, it ie the result of a political panic almost shrink from enunciating the precise cause, cbvions aa it ia to every Senator and intelligent man in the land. We hear Of Iegislatares bsg, paged and conventions being ordered to consider the great question whether the rela toe tbat bind us together are to be continued or not. It | ing the Cesires of men of his own party. | Is is thes that we have seen manifested deep concern ard distress, Sir, this is a sad picture, It seems to me that it isthe part of patriotism and duty to ok the danger that besets us fair im the face. Yy ewn impressions at first were, that the least said the better, Ihave changed that impression, I believe thet the times require that the public men—the select men of the nation here, should sum up the great ques- ticn, here. For one,1am prepared to separate myself as far as possible from past Prejudices and party ‘allegiance, and cousicer the condition of the country in {the spirit of de- votion to its interests, I must heartily commend the posi- tion of the Senator from Connecticut, without understand- He has told it here regardless of connection with his party prejudices for I believe he is a friend of the President elect. He has came forward boldly and taken his position for the con- stituticn—ior the Union as made by the constitution—for the equality of the States, and for justice among his fel kw citizens of the United States. “A conyention of all the States can be only called when two-thirds of the State petition Congress. Every way, Congress must have a connection with this subject. We should inquire caimiy, scberly, and carnestly of each other, what can be done here. The South has received my co-operation long. I will resort to any honorable means to save the Union. I wish to see this government maintain its dignity and influence in the world. If it was worth the sacrifices that were made for it, itis certainly worth the effort o preserving. If you want permanent peace, you must Htrike at the root of the diebas hearts of fen mus Northern men must put down the abolition I give the South her rights, while the South must act justly towards the North on the tariff question, Manufacturers and miners believed that the democratic party was prejudiced against protection, and therefore ave gone over to the republicans. No man is war- ranted in saying that the State of Pennsylvania will achere to the doctrines of the republican Party. The issue of the “irrepressible conflict” is not fully iuter- preted in that State. What! because of a party victory is the country to be torn by violence, riots and mobs in your ccmmercial cities, and business completely deran- ged? What! is a party triumph to cause misfortune? It is worse than dissolution. Ishall do all in my power to adjust these unbappy differences. Iam not despond- ent entirely, Icanuot bring my mind to believe ina scparation of these States—much less to contemplate the consequences which would follow. 1 predict that the re- publican party will nevor gain another vidtory. Mr. IVERRSON, (opp.) of Ga.—I am not Willing to vote for the resolution of the Senator from Kentucky, and I desire briefly to set myseif right upon the record. 1 wish to give the country the reasons that influence my action. Tebject to this committee, or to this proposition to sub- mit all these difficulties to a committee of thirteen. I don’t exactly understand the object. What is intended to be executed by this committee has not been explained the honorable Seuator who introduced it. I don’t under- stand whether C ional legislation is to be invoked to relieve us from the impending danger, nor do I under- stand that constitutional amendments are to be proposed by the two houses of Congress. I am not advised as to what is expected of that commitee. Whatever may be the object, whether in the shape of al tion, in the shape of amendments to the constitution, in whatever design or object may be contemplated, I have no confidence in the accomplishment of anything. Now, sir, let us look at this question from a reasonabl and common sense standing. Is it designed to make Con- greesicnal legislation to remove the objections which the Fouthern States have to remaining in the Union? it designed to introduce legislation for pro tectirg the rights and equality of the South. em States, more than they are now by the constitution, and the present laws? If so, what is Con- gressional legislation, so far as the Fugitive Slave law is concerned, to the rights of the Southern people, under the obstructions and difficulties—insurmountable difficul- ties—which are preserfted to the execution of that law by @ vitiated public sentiment in the Northern States? What more can Congress do than Congress has done? We have a Fogitive Slave law of which the South, does com- plain, It is sufficiently guarded to accomplish all the ‘8 for which it was designed, if there was a proper ntiment in the Northern ‘States. No bette fy. ve law could. be devised, by this Cvagreas or It ciothed the judiciary and ¢~entive of this government with ample powers to ©xeguie the laws. We “on't complain that any xe ige has ever been derelict in bis cuty im the ditvarge of this law. Mr. Fillmore was President Whoe this law was passed, and it received ‘8 sane’et; and I am ready to say that, so far as he ‘Wak, concerned, he earried it out. General Pierce carried 2¢ Out, and the present executive. So far as they have the power they have done their duty faithfully. ‘But we know well that no slave has been reclaimed from the Northern States except under circumstances of the greatest difficulty and danger, and often loss of life. It ts not a defect in the law itself, but it is in the fact, to which no man can shut his eyes, that a vitiated public sentiment in the Northern States is so strong against slavery that no enactment can ever be carried out while this state of public sentiment lasts, It is trae that now and then @ slave is reclaimed; but it has been done at the point of the bayonet, and at an expense of ten times the valne of the slave. Why is it, sir? Not hecause the law is defective, but because public senti- ment is defective and wrong. Nor do I charge the fail ure of the execution of this law upon these Personal Liberty bills. No, sir, they have never ted to pre- vent the exceution of the Fugitive Slave This, as T said, mob law, in all cireumstances, which has produced these results, and will as long as the Union and slavery last er. Whenever a fugitive slave shall be dis- covered in one of the free States, and the owner goes in pursuance of law and the constitution to reclaim him, what follows? They obtain the arrest of the slave, but be- fore the case comes before a justice, or before judgment can be rendered, there is a mob of free negroes and whites who are only one degree removed from their colored brothers in brutality and ignoranon They assemble and wrest the negro from the possession of the owner, while the conservative masses, the “ gentlemen,’’ thove who are in favor of justice, who believe the owner is en- Uitled, under the constitution and the law, to reclaim the slave, what do they do? They stand with folded arms, ‘and jock upon these mobs, ‘and to scorn these Sou people. Even shire said the other day that he believed the Southern people were entitled to reclaim their slaves. But how often has he stood by and seen there mobs execute their foul mses? bias he ever striven to correct this vi tiated public sentiment? Sir, he has stimulated it, and #0 have other Senators from the North. Mr. Hae, ns RY N. H., (in his seat)—Never. Mr. Iverson— it more can Congress do on this sub. ject? Does the Senator from Kentucky propose to amend the Fugitive Slave law? It has been sug; remedy might be found in an alteration tion in some act of Congress, in which the free States, who secrete and refuse to bring back our slaves, will be liable iu damages. In the first piace, what would euch a law be worth? You can't sue aState, A State tn its sovereign capacity cannot be brongbt into court. If a thousand slaves were received by Massachusetts, and refuted to be returned, how can you sue the State of ‘ty are a anit eth on whie DN ’ the very principle which stands at the basis of their poli tical organization. It is, that slavery shall not advance beyond its present boundaries and shall never piant a footprint in the Territories of the United States. It must necesearily meet the dienggroval ‘of every one of the 1,850,000 republicans who cast their votes for Lincoln and Hamlin; and how many Northern demo- crate will be brought to its support? We know well that, as far as a portion of the Northern democrats are concerned, they were as hostile to this principle as the republicans tamaelves. The Northern Dougias-noo- interference squat sovereignty party is represented on this floor by the Benator from illinois, and hig. friend tr, Pugh. | Would the for it? We have already beard the Senator from Ohio say he would let his arm rot from bis shoulder in its socket, before he would vote for Congressional protection. 1 tell Senators here to. day that the Southern people will never be satisfied with anything ebort of Congressional tion to slavery in the Territories. We know our righte under the constita- tion, We stand as equal States in this confederacy, and we are entitled to equal participation in the common pro: perty, We know well that we never can enjoy equal pos session of the Territories without protection to our proper. Tknow well where the Wilmot Proviso and non-in ention-equatter-eovercignty would lead. It would Jead to the total exclusion of the Southern States from any Territary which is now or may be here ed. We will never submit to any such dicta re entitled to the protection of our , and we intend to have it, in the Union if we nel out of the Union if we cannot get it in. 1 he object of all this probibitory legislation The result of both is to exclude the South fram any en trance into the Territories with their age) pss it is to clreumecribe the area of slavery, and to hem it in on all «ides, and by the fons of the federal govern ment upon the Wordee tmosie, compelling them, as a matter of poliey and intereet, ih order to got rid of their slavts, to precipitate them upon the cotton States, Then, sir, it will be but a few months before the border States Union Will become free States. Let this pass into the hands of the republican ment govern! —let them be installed in ‘er—let them get Saka ot the two house. of Orn ey, wil , as they will , Sending their th, ‘et all the rid of such slaves as nd railroad,’ States. Dela ri and Kentucky would, er of the free States of thit thus carried off from the border South will be confined in a few tates and sold to yours to some eight or ten Gulf States, Now, sir, jook ay Let the people understand what view is taken of it _ | the process. We have now in the Unit» “tates four mil- lions ard a half of slaves. They incre ise. according to the last census bill, at the rate of abou! thirty-two per cont every ten years. If you precipitate «il this popula- tion into eight or ten Gulf States we will have, in ten years, 6,000,000—in twenty years we shall hav ‘or 9,600,000, and, in thirty years, 12,000,000 to In kes ‘than twenty years the slave popula | South will largely preponderate over ie wht will ccme universal emancipation by the federal yov ern ment, and such scenes of murder between the tw) races as has never been seen or heard of in the whole wor d’s history. Such, in my opinion, is the inevitable resu t..nd such is the pois, of the free States. They understand as well as I do how these things work out, and it is especially their course to bring about this very state ot things, and in that very form. Long before these even's occur the free States will be swelled by majority that is irreriatible. The border States will be free, the Terri. tories West will be planted into States by tbe hot-bed process of Northern abolition emigration, and the South will be lying at the very feet of the North’ Yet the border States complain of the cotton States in the movement ‘that is now in progress. They say we have no right to take them out of the Union against their will. Sir, I waut to know what right they have to keep us in the Union against our willy If we want to go out, fot us go. If they want to stay, let them stay, They are sovereign States, Let them decide this question for themselves. I will not complain, when aud how, and where they go Tam satis- fied, however, that they will go when the time comes for them to decide. They complain of us, that we mike so much noise and confusion about the Fugitive Slave law when we do not lose any slaves; but it is not for the wan of good faith in the Northern States, so far as the re clamation of fugitive slaves is concerned, that the South- «rn States are moving in this great revolution. We look infinitely beyond this petty loss of a few negroes. We know what is coming. Sir, in this Union, it is universal emancipation, and the turning loose upon society, in the Southern States, of this mass of corruption which will be made by emancipation. And we intend to avoid it if we can. ‘The border States can get along without slavery. ‘Their climate and soil are appropriate to white labor. They can live and fourth without slavery. The cotton States cannot. We are obliged to have African slavery to cultivate our rice and cotton fies, African slavery is essential to our ex- istence us a people. It is not surprising, when we fee this storm coming from the North to overwhelm us, that we should seek our safety when we can, by set- ting up for ourselves an independent sovereignty upon which none of these causes can produce any eflect. And now, again recurring to the question, I tell Senators that the Southern States now moving for secession will never be satisfied with any concession made by the North that does not fully recognise not only the existence of slavery in its present form, but also the right of the Southern people to emigrate to the common Territories with their slave property, and their right to Congressional protection while in this pig a The recent battle in the South was fought upon that very issue. Upon that very issue the friends of Mr. Breckinridge put him upon the very ground of protection to slave property, and it was on that ground he carried the cotton States. I know there was a small party opposed to that principle that followed the lead of the Senator from Illinois, but how small! 1 had almost said how con- temptible the element in the Southern States that advoca- ted that princi Look at the popular vote. That will tell the tale. who supported the third candidate were in favor of protection, and in my State they called ‘on the people to support Mr. Bell, on the very ground that he was in favor of boy yay = Protection. And now it is @ fact well known thata large ‘tion of the friends of Mr. Bell are the most ardent leaders in the resent movement. It is because they have lost all ope of getting protection from this government. Gentlemen need not mistake the feeling of Southern States, that is, the cotton States. Jt ig in faver of Congressional ‘protection, ad amendments of constitution. itever will fall short of that will not be of any weight, or even be accepted by the Southern States. What prospect have we of getting that? None here, none anywhere. Why, therefore, the necessity of this resolution? But, sir, cuppose that the object of this resolution be present amendments to the constitution, and to give Southern States additional guarantees, | want to know of the friends of the resolu- tion what particular guarantees they expect, or what con- cessions? I do not believe any concessions can be ob- tained, and if they are obtained, of what value would they be, granted in @ state of fear? Ido not use this word in any offensive sense. But the North, if it yields at all, yields to the fear that the South is going to dis- solve the Union. What value would such concessions be to the South? Nay, I want to know what value any pledges or guarantees would be from the Northern States? None, sir, as long as a vitiated public senti- ment of abolition exists. And when {s that going decay? Never, #o long as the Union ts, It is @ part of their political creed. It enters into all their ramifications of society, into the pulpit, the schoolhouse. All teach this doctrine of the * irrepressible conflict ;’ and how many arguments in favor of Slavery, its morality, its social blessings, ever reach the Northern ear? How are you going to reach this feeling? There is but one way. “That ir, to let the South go out of the Union; and when the North sees it folly, then the feeling may recoil, and a sound state o feeling may arise, but not till then. Suppose constitu tional guarantees are presented by this Committee—they Teport ‘the proposed amendments to the constitution ‘What reliance can the South place upon the good faith and observance of these guarantees by the North? What better guarantees can be mace than those ef the constitution? If they were carried out im wood faith, it would be all the South woukt ask or . violated by the on the history of our country. The consti tution was formed #8 compromise. One was that new States might be admitted, and the existence of Slavery should be no reason for refusal to admit. Th first state that came, the North refused to admit, be- cause her Constitution tolerated Slavery. That was Mis- ‘souri. The obstinate opposition of the North in this re- t drove the South toa d com] ise, ir. I. them referred to the admission of Texas in 1844, to the Territories acquired from Mexico in 1848 to the Tariff ise of 1833, and the violation of lighted faith by te North in the tariff of 1842, and then continued: 1 , then, how can the South rely on any guarantees the North may make, especially under the circumstances which now exist, when these tees are to be wrung from them under duress. 1 have nocon- fidence in the plighted faith, Puntea fides of the Northern people. [don’t believe my constituents are willing to ac- cept my compromise, no matter how plausible, upon pa- per, because we know it will only be @ paper compro- mise, which is not worth the ‘of @ man’s finger. upon this proposition as nothing else than a delu- sion arnare, intended to operate on the public mind in these receding States, and to put arguments into the mouths of the submissive party at the South, and urge upon on @ little more delay, @ littie more fold- ing of + & little more procrastination, Put it off, put §it Off. Let us see what this great propo. sition will Work out. Try everything that is is suggested by my friend from Pennsylvania (Mr. Bigler): We have accomplished ‘and power patronage, what are we to expect a rapid consummation of the dire troubles which I ha depicted? I believe this proposition ern end in nothing but delay. I believe the question i# rettled, and no this side of Heaven can avert the result. South Varolina has determined to risk all on thie die, and otber States will follow. Those weet of the Missiseip- ye mg | ‘That thie Union is to be dissolved is a xed fact, and no tinkering of the constitution or of committees of thirty-three or thirteen can avert the consequences. I desire to may a few words by way of sugevetion to the States of Virginia and Mary’ |, and especially to the District of Columbia. I hear every day, net only in the streets, but see it in the public press, curses loud and deep poured out upon the devoted heads of the Southern States. The people of the District of Columbia have turned all their wrath, not to the trae cause, the abolitionists of the North, but they are venting their epleen and epite against us because we are vindicating our ‘own independence and liberty. They expect the dissolu- tion of this Union is going to destroy the Capitol, and their property i to be valuelese, That may or may not be. it will di very much on their own conduct. In my opinion that five States will go out of this Union before the 4th of March and form a confederacy of their own admits of no doubt, and that the other slave States must follow in the rapid process of time, I have little less doubt. Well, if Virginia and Maryland desire to have any influence or part in the formation of our government and Union, to which must finally owe allegiance, they bad better follow our example quick—(laughter)—and send delegates to join ‘our to frame a government for our support and pro: tection. It may be a government will be formed and & constitution enacted before they have time to take & in it, and when they come ont of thie Union. tail end of whith they must learn to follow our ex ample, they may find in the elements of that constitut he things which influence the movement of these States. They are a little afraid ing of the African slave trade and the Fees eee tn walntnctn tet ome wi ia, My motto has teen to asked. eo far as cerned, | want t say to Maryland secedes and 1, for one, sir, would be in favor of continuing Whshington as the seat of government, Laughter.) erie peuple laugh. 1 don’t know why. {Renewed ooghter.)” This is Important to these people, whoown brick and ‘mortar, for, #ir, if gonded as we may be by the taste of this people here, and obetructed as we may te by the tardy action of Virginia and Maryland In this great movement, we may form our republic and establish the seat of government so per- manently that it may never be removed. Then there marble now teeming with life au luxury, the babitations of beauty and grace ar elegance, instad of echoing to the scenes of mirth and melody, will become the habita- tions of the bats and the owls. But to & ‘back. 1 tell you the question is rettled in relation to this ge movement, Nothing can stay the hand of the Southern people or cool the patriotiem which is burning in the southern heart. When the arbitrary government of Louis Philippe, in 1848, bad raised the le of Paris to a sense of daner and rebellion, and the barricades of Paris and the masses of that great city were upheaving, Louis Philippe saw the danger, and attempted to avert it by changing his Ministry, but the words “Too late,” “Too late,” went through the streets of Paris. The next day he abdicated the throne in favor of his grandson. The same words, Too lat g through the streets, ring- ng out in sepulchral tones, like the trump of the Archangel summoning the dead to judgment. And 80, new, you may tinker the constitution, you may sug- Rest legislation, you may present additional constitu- Uonal guarantees, you may attempt, by all these means, to stay the storm that now rages, and to pre vent the people from marching on to deliverance and iberty. But, sir, the words “Too Late,” “Too late,” will ring out here to-day, will be reiterated from moun- tain to valley, of all the South to the North sounding, the death knell of the confederacy. Mr. Pucu (opp.), of Ohio, said—Do you hope to continue the Union from the extraordinary ‘speech just heard? When the people of any State, organization, or Territory or community do not desire to have the institution of my right arm shall fall from the socket before I them to accept i Mr. IveRsoN said—I refer you to my speech of February 28, last year, when I was in the chair. You did not say “yes” then. ' I referred to the Burns fugitive slave case. ‘Mr. PvcH—That is only one case. Mr. Ivexson read from the Congressional Globe to prove that Mr. Pugh did not adhere now to what he had stated previous to this session. Mr. Pucu—Let me read the rest. (Laughter.) I con- = that the Fugitive Slave law was trampled under oot. Mr. IveRvox—Twenty years ago an elaborate report was made by order of the Virginia Legislature, proving that «ne hundred thousand dollars worth of slaves were lost annually from its limits by their being fugitives. Mr. Pucn—I do not believe that all the slave States have loet a hundred thousand dollars by their fugitives. Mr. Dovaras—I did not propose to enter into this dis- cussion at the present time further than to remark, in response to the charge made against my section of ‘the country in regard to the non-execution of the Fugitive slave law. ‘That law, like many others, is not al- ways enforced in all cases. I suppose there never was a statute law that was not sometime violated with impu- nity, or not enforced with as much fidelity sa it ought to be. I su the Fugitive Slave law is en- forced with as much fidelity as that in regard to the African slave trade, But, sir, I confess it is not en- forced as faithfully as I wish it was, or as it ought to be. \While IT make this declaration, Iam compelled to say that nine-tenths of the complaints on that subject are unfounded. where there is sectional strife and excitement there seems to be a proneness on the part of the newspaper press, in both sections, to collect and give every fact which would inflame the passions and prajudices of one section against the other. In that way, partial and un- fair statements of facts are given, section act under an apprnhension of the other. sir, as far a8 linois is concerned, I am pre y that in nineteen cases out of twenty where a fugitive slave enters Illinois, he is arrested and returned without any Judicial process whatever. Those portions of the State which border on the Kentucky and Missouri lines are in harmony with their neighbors on the other side, and a fu- gitive sare is returned as regularly as a stclen horse. So in nineteen cases out of twenty where the fugitive is re- turned the newspapers do not notice the fact, and even the records of the court have no notice of it. in cases where there is an arrest, as a matter of course, he is returned if he turns out to be a fugitive, an there is no excitement. But, perhaps, in the twentieth case, the country where the public sentiment is more excited, and once in a while a rescue is made, then the newspapers are filled with the horrors of that rescue. And the one case of the rescue is paraded by the news- paper press of the whole country, and although an ex- ceptional case, it is represented as evidence of the eneral character. I recollect one instance of that fina occurred in my own State, and that instance have noticed im more than twenty Southern ne papers within the last two months parad: dence of our infidelity in the enforcement of the law. And the newspapers tell us of the rescue by the abo- litionists, but there the tale stope, And then the com- ments are made as to how hey can live together with such treatment. The tale, so , is true, But it is pot all told. Ifthey had wished to tell it fairly, they should have recorded the further fact that the United States Marshal appeared at Ottawa and arrested the and took them to Chicago, where, in default they were remanded to prison until the Ist of they were tried, found guilty, and sen- tenced by a republican Judge of the United States Court to the penalties of the law. That is the balance of the Je. If it bad been told, it could never have been fuel for this sectional excitement. tr peunitien of the law are not inflicted upon the res cuere. And then civil suits are brought to pay for the slave and not only the ep but smart money granted. I think, therefore, there is little ground of it, so far us the section of the country in which I live is concerned; and yet I know that the Southern are induced to believe that if a slave into the North he is gone forever, They are to think so be- cause the cases of actual returns are never published, and only the exceptional cases of rescue come to the knowledge of the le. I with we could have @ list of the fugitive slaves that are returned and of the number reseued, and I venture the assertion, that Southern itlemen would be amazed at the fidelity with which that law bas been executed. I believe if we could bave a record of the cases, they would be ashamed to bring up that subject as one of the causes to justify the dissolution of the Union. I have no apology to make for the Personal Liberty bills. I think them all a violation of the spirit of the constitu. tion, and | think they ought to be re at once, and think our Northern people ought to repeal them as @ duty to themeelves—not upon any demand of the Southern people, but to put ourselves in the right. The State T have the honor to t never passed any such law. I wish there was no cause of complaint of any other State. While we hear of Pergoval Liberts bills presented as cause of disunion, we are 4 so far as I know, the statement is true—that in no one case have these bills been the cause of depriv- ing a master of the return of his slave. These bills gene- rally exist in that part of the country where fugitives never come, yet it so happens that is the great- est excitement on this question, Just in proportion from the line which divides the ‘The Presapest (Mr. Fitzpatrick in the chair)—The Chair stated upon the repetition of applause the galleries would be cleared. Mr. Dorerss—Now. as between Iilinoie and Ken- tueky, we should ha westion. So, in fact, ates, who know the evils of which they complain, and the proper remedy, if they could be permitted*to decide this question and assure you the Union would last forever. If this Union is to be severed, it is upon the ground that the two extremes, so far from cagh other that they do not understand the evils of the question, are acting under misapprehension toward other, and hence doing injustice to each other. But I will not go into a discussion of the subject. My object in arising war to sustain my friend from Objo in bis declarations, ws far as our Northwestern country is concerned, that the Fugitive Slave law is execuied with as much Ha ae moet of the laws upon the statute books, 1 would be betes bes leave Lot ps = to Judge MeLsan, whether he ever knew a jury who refused to find a ver dict, where the facts would permit of a verdict. Mel ean republican as he is, has executed the Slave law with entire fidelity, so far as I know. may be instances where a fugitive slave runs away, oa is never found. There are instances where Judge ‘itive: horees are stolen’ and we never find them, But I am speaking of the ints which arine from — the —non-execution ® of the law. = My Cbyrct je not to create€rritation, but to soothe the excited. state of feeling, in order that we may discuss this ques- ion im proper temper and upon ite merits. My [om ye ie to meet this question fairly, Lat us ascertain prec’ the points in dispnte, and lay aside all sectional feeling and ae aed fee if we cannot agree on a line o policy which will secure equal rights, equal protection and equal justice to every State and the ‘etlesnd of every State in this Union, Mr. Iven#oN—If a fugitive ie found secreted in a house one day, on the next morning he is quis likely to b» ron of. rep.) of N. J—A instance like jew Jersey. The fugitive was run off. It & the only one inetanoe known in the State. Mr. Gnexx, (opp.) of Mo.—If @ man runs off a horse, is lowe is @ pecuniary consideration only; but to sta ‘a negro it is Something more. T wish the arm 0 the it to {ta functions; a governmen that won't do it I would spit upon. 1 would sooner have Mr overeat speak only ae to the non-execution of the lat we. Mr. Frrew, .) of Ind.—1 know my State. For the laet ‘eee t yiare there has been but one instance of the resove of a fugitive. Mr. Powrn—Scme time ago ® negro ran away from Kentueky to I/inoi®, and the Governor of the latter Com- morwenlth did not perform his duty Mr. Wane, (rep.) of Obio=If 1 recollect right the in- dietment did not show that the party was ever in Ken- tucky. 0 Mr. Powxi—The genteman (Mr. Wade) is evidently mistaken. Mr. Wape—I do not know much about it. Mr. Powki1—You had better, then, investigate the facts of the case before you draw the attention of the Senate to it. Mr. Pucu—Is the gentleman (Mr. Powell) aware of all the facts? Mr. Powet1—The Governor Tinois was w-oig Mr. Davis, (opp.) of Miss.—Alas! itall resulted in crim. ination and recrimination Mr. Maron, (opp.) of Va.—Our grievances are great. a ve been humiliated. 2 . Ir. DovGias—Congress should apply the necessary. le- gislation. A convention of se parate States to settle this matter is not necessa’ Mr. Mason—We have become satistied that unless wo evidences that the constitution and the laws will be \ pheld by « convention of the differentStates, we are not bound to remain in the U; Mr. CoLamKR, (rep.) of Vi—The State Legislatures should aid in establishing a frateral feeling. Mr. Wicrart, (opp.) of Texas—Slaves have been recog- nized as property in at least three places in the constitu- tion. Our rights have been violated Mr. Dovciss—Because the rights of the Southern States. have been violated, does that justify them in Jeaving the ‘ion ? Mr. Wicratt—The Senator from Hlinois (Mr, Douglas), nstead of answering one question propounds another. Mr. Davis cited the bill annulling the legislation of Kansas. ‘This caured a general interchange of expressions be- ‘ween Messrs. Davis, Wigfall, Brown and Douglas, pend- ng which, on motion of Mr. Wigfall, the Senate, at half- past four, adjourned, House of Representatives, Wasutworon, Deo. 11, 1860, THE QUPSTION OF EXCUSING MEMAERS FROM SERVING ON THR COMMITTEE OF THIRTY-THKEK—DEBATE ON THK STATE OF THE COUNTRY. Mr. Conn, (opp.) of Ala., resumed the debate on the motion of Mr. Hawkins, to be excused from serving on the Committee of Thirty-three, He said, if he under- stood aright, the first question in order was on the mo- tion to excuse the gentleman from Florida from serving on the Special Committeo of Thirty-three, appointed on ‘Thursday last. It was not his purpose to make a speech, because he was satisfied that the eyes of the whole coun try were now directed to what this House should do and the report that this committee should make. He was anxious that something should proceed from that com- mittee, hoping—though he must confess his hopes were very faint—that something wouk! result from the action of that committee to restore peace to the country. If anything was to be done which would have the effect of causing his State, Alabama, to remain in the Union, it must be done immediately, for an election for representatives toaState Convention was to take place on the 24th of this month, and the Convention is to meet on the 7th of next. He would like to present his views in relation to the various questions which that committee would be called upon to consider, but duty admonished him to withhold those views, and ask more particularly that the viour question be sustamed, in order that ¢ ve a vote upon the proposition to excuse the member from Florida, as they would have similar propositions to act upon in regard to other members, and therefore the time of the House would be occupied in discussing each question, when there was not a moment to lose. The public mind was now in anxious sus- pense, and therefore something ought to be done immediately. What means the crowded state of the galleries here to-day? He asked the question; it was easily answered—whby, because of the excitement which Pepeos! the whole country. Not only here, but all over he country, they were looking da yea, hourly, for this House todo something. #hould they now monopo- lize the time that shoul upied by this committee in discussing questions whic ld come up, in all proba- bility, after the report of the committee’ He thought not, He trusted that when he asked for the previous question debate would be terminated, and his call sustained. He was glad to see by the papers this morving that action was being bad in the North which would have a tendency to change the public mind, A gleam of light had already come from Boston. He hoped that the North would meet in her conventions, agg wherever an election was held demonstr: 0 the cout that there was now a returning sense of justice, and that the questions which had agitated the country heretofore would be taken hold of by the people themselves, and so disposed of ax to ive eatisfacticn to the country. I expressed the fr pe that the committee would endeavor to present some measures which would restore harmony to this now dis tracted country. As far as his own State was cor he would say that he knew she would not r this confederacy longer than the Lith of January, unless something was done. His prayer was that soiething might be done to enable her to remain in the Union, upon constitutional and equal principles. He was not a seces sionist, He desired peace, but he desired it predicated upon the principles of the coustitution, He now called the previous question. Mr. Davis, (opp.) of Mies.. Mr. Speaker— The Srmaken—The previous question is demanded by the gentleman from Alabama. Mr. Davis—I hope the gentleman from Alabama will withdraw itfor afew moments. I will not dotain the House long. Mr. Conp—Will the gentleman renew it when he has concluded ¥ Mr. Comp—Then I withdraw it. Mr. Davis said—Mr. Speaker, the member from Fk (Mr, Hawkins), and the'member from South Carolina | (ar. Boyce), have each requested this House to relieve em from serving on this committee, and have given their reasons there- for. It ‘may not be improper in me to give some jon of my determined course of action. accept tt ointment, and shall meet and act with the committee. For this course I may be blamed here, and censured at home; still, as my judgment dictates’ thie course a8 proper, abd ax my conscience approves it, I de. fy the world’s opinion. I stand here to-day, not the rep- resentative of my own preferences, but as the represen- tative of the feelings and interests of fourteen thousand voters. Their interests and their wishes shall be the rule of my action while Thold a seat upon this floor. I trust, however, to be allowed to express my regret that the resolution creating this committee came from a Southern: member, a distinguished representative of the Common- wealth of Virginia, and whose action was endorsed by a very large majority of members from the Southern States I cannot, therefore, consider it dishonorable te serve on it. While [ expect nothing useful to the har- mony of the country from the action of this committee, I shall guard against its being made to operate \ arrest the present action of the Southern States in the progress they are making to secure their equality and rights cut of the Union, since they have been unable to secure them in it. In my judgment, a proper respect for the dignity of the South Gemancs that the members of this committee from the Southern States should all withdraw, aud leave the republican members to meet, consult and’ submit an matum for the consideration of the various dele- gations from the Southern States. Since, however, this will not be done, I shall act with them, in the hope that no Southern member will so disregard his self-respect aa our constitution ite am) to reture to the Southorn States all rights, State and = dividual, if honest and faithfully wdminixtered in strict accordance with its letter and spirit; and as the conscience of the republican party will not allow its provisions to bo executed, | do not hope to find any security in any com. promise, or in reconstruction of the constitution. The cnly eafé guarantee we can rely upon, is in an evidence that fanaticism has been extinguished in the minds of the people of the North, and that a sense of jus- tice has been restored. It has well been said, “our Union rests upon public opinion.” ‘Then, if it lives at all, it must live in the affections of the people; but a« that has been entirely extinguished, at least so’ far as the republican Party ie concerned, T have no of main. taining it by compromise or by the use of the sword, Any poliey, then, of the now dominant republican party which destroys sil affection for the Union in the hearts of the people of the lave States, must and has already de- stroyed the only cord that can bind the Union. In my Judgment the sutyees matter referred to this committee does not properly belong to this House, and should not have originated here. The alarming controversy which now fo generally disturbe the popular mind of this great hation grows out of priveiples and systems advanced by the dominant party in the free States of this Union, which, in the estimation of the slave States, aro subversive the constitutional compact between’ the States, and directly at war with their safety gnd mate- rial interests. It has thus become @ direct issue be- tween the States, and can only be ted by them. We cannot do anything in a controversy like this to bind the tates, and it is fruitlers to try it. Fenators are the representatives of the States, and if any action is had by Congress on this gubject it should have originated With them, and not with us, Tecan but regard this com- mittee as a tub thrown out to the whale to amure only tii? the 4th of March next, and then arrest the nt no- ble and manly movements of the Southern and to provide by that day for their security and safety out of the Union. With there views, T take rf _ on thi committee, for the purpore of preventing it being made ‘8 means of deception, by which the public mind is to be misled and misguided, yet intendin triotieaily to entertain any fair proposition for adjust. ment of pending evils which the republican members may eubmit, House voted and refused to excise Mr. Hawkine— 95 against 101 Mr. Hawnise, (opp.) of Fia., leet silence would be con- strued into cc to gerve on the committee, wished to say, with all deference and feeling for those who ‘voted against his , that he would not eerve. Mr. Boyer, (opp.) Of 8. C., asked to be excused from rervice on the committee. - cure ieee ki id er ive ly it atiahed the cowsmstiter did not express 0 fens of eS a to will remain only & Pe then, refuse, to excuse Mr. Boyce? Is force the mous and Rammer of testi yp yh a view W re- tore peace ee count Mr. Ss, of Virginia, replied be would not nee forse, He war one of those who refused to excuse Mr. Hawkins, and after the lecture of Mr. Burnett he felt it hie duty to vindicate hie vote. Present affuire are big with the agirs of the republic, and direuseion on the question waa not likely good. bie eur. vee CONTINUED ON Holl TAUB)" | =